suggestions for an analogue desk

[tommynuker]

Hi all

 

Heres a list of what I want a desk to offer, had alook at several options but would like some others peoples opinoins on what desk I should get (you ever heard a salesmen tell you a bad thing about their product)

 

20-30 channels

each channel with a preamp, phantom power, hpf, 4band parametric eq, insert points

4+ aux

4 groups.

 

 

I quite like the look of the mackie onyx 1640, but it only has 16 channels which will get eaten up, apparently they are bringing another line of onyx mixers out with 8auxes, so a 2480 sounds rather tasty :-) but thats not until halway through 2005 :-(, also looked at the soundcraft lx7ii but just dont like tyhe feel of it????

 

thanks for any advice

[James]

For Analouge I use an LX7 24ch frame and have no complaints about the feel of it but I can understand if you don't like it.

 

I'm surprised you prefer the mackie though. Is this for live touring work? live installed or installed recording?

 

I assume you have looked at, Soundcraft Live 24, Allen & Heath GL2200, Midas Venice?

 

If 16ch isn't enough for you then I assume that the Mixwizard range is too small for you...

 

 

James

[paulears]

if you want a larger desk with more space and loads of aux/groups have a look at the yamaha ga32/12. yamaha uk will NOT supply one, but you can get them easily from europe and with a different model number, from the usa. it's a very strange desk in that the 10 auxes may be used in any combination as groups or auxes. I bought one for a specific job where lots of sources had to go to different places - a son et lumiere with 9 separate loudspeaker locations. has a useful matrix too. only down side is that there is no individual channel meering, just 10 groups, l/r and matrix. a google search will find it.

 

very heavy, so a proper flightcase is a must.

[misterbassman]

Check out the New Soundcraft GB4, it will available in 32 and 40 channel versions (as well as some smaller frame sizes), It comes complete with 8 aux, 4 groups, and uses the same EQ and pre-amps as the MH4 console.

It will be available mid-end Jan '05. I have a 24 channel version on pre-order.

 

Dan

[Bobbsy]

The new GB4 looks pretty hard to beat for your application...though I still have a soft spot for Allen and Heath. The GL2200 is a great sounding board for the money. BTW, I also liked the LX7 more than any Mackie I've tried....I much prefer the Soundcraft mic pres and EQ section.

 

Having said all that, if I was investing in a new board now, it would NOT be analogue. I'm now firmly convinced that digital is the way to go. I recently replaced my Soundcraft Live 24 with a Yamaha DM1000, but for lot less money the O1V96 or the Behringer DDX3216 are worth a peek. Yes, there's a learning curve, but the UI on newer digital boards is streets ahead of the "old days of digital" and the flexibility/built in effects put the value for money of digital well ahead of analogue IMHO.

 

Bob

[slim_mcslim]

you can take yer digital desk and put it where binary doesn't shine!!!

 

the ga 32/12 is a fantastic desk, extremley versatile and works well, I find it a bit plastic feeling all though it isn't made of plastic - its actually made of steel and concrete! (well maybe not the concrete) I can just lift the 24 channel version myself - but the 32 channel is a 2 man lift, compared with the allen & heath gl2200 which is about half the weight, but it is a marvelous desk for the money, has the feel of a high quality console is extremely quiet and I think it comes in cheaper than the yamaha.

 

paul...

[Bobbsy]

Nah...I take my digital desk and shove it into making a profit, being a joy to drive, and keeping the producers happy with a tiny footprint I can now get away with in terms of the space I need for a mix position.

 

My DM1000 (with ADAT expansion cards and Behringer ADA8000 converters) is a one man lift for 48 channels. Before I carry a single item of outboard, I have a gate, a compressor limiter, and 4 band parametric EQ on all 48 channels. I also have 4 channels of Yamaha quality effects units, 8 aux sends (individually switable pre/post on every channel, not just globally) and 8 busses. Oh, and (including the outs on the ADA8000s) I have 48 separate outputs.

 

I also have 99 presets that can control EVERY parameter (unlimited if I link a laptop to my mixer) allowing me to play with routings and effects in way I wouldn't dream of attempting in analogue. Worryingly, the presets also let me leave a complex show to my A2 halfway through (wife went into labour!)...and he ran the whole thing flawlessly calling up the memories. I don't WANT to be redundant, but... ;)

 

Finally, the learning curve was such that after my first show, I was confident, after several I now feel sorely limited when I go back to analogue! If your views of digital boards are coloured by the previous, very awkward User Interface, it really is worth trying the current batch...they are now very intuitive and I don't ever have to work through a menu for any of the main "during the show" adjustments.

 

I'm sure your GA32/12 is a fine analogue board (though I'd still prefer Soundcraft or Allen and Heath) but for my money digital is the only way to go nowadays. (And I mean that literally about "my money", having recently written the cheque!)

 

Bob

[James]

I also have 99 presets that can control EVERY parameter

 

Not EXACTLY,

 

You can't save changes to patch information with presets, some cascade functions you cant change and you cant change wordclock source. (OK you can save links to an I/O patch preset but the patch information isn't saved in the preset. Other than that..... /pedant)

 

James

[Bobbsy]

Well...I'll grant you the word clock source is fixed...and also that some of the cascade functions are not controlled by the presets.

 

However, I think mention of the input/output patches is a "pedantry too far" since any of my 99 presets can specify any of 99 input patches and any of 99 output patches!

 

(Which is 98 more than any analogue board I know of!)

 

Oh, and I forgot the best part of a DM1000. The box makes an excellent bed for a baby until we get moved back to our house with the proper cot!

 

;)

 

Bob

[James]

True I accept your accusation of pedantry but I've had problems when operators have got themselves in problems fiddling with the patch and found they couldn't get back to a known state by recalling a previously good scene.

 

I'll take your word on the usefulness of the box though. ;)

 

James

[slim_mcslim]

I am pleased that you enjoy your box of trickery...

 

however there is no way on this earth that you can adjust the eq on two channels at the same time, or the balance on two channels at the same time, which is very necessary when the presenter is standing in front of a speaker and insists on putting the handheld over his shoulder to get it out of the way.

 

and I do think digital desks have there place, but I know I couldn't give a digital desk to any of my freelance sound guys not without them winging more than a lampy (and lampies don't half winge)

 

I am not familiar with the dm1000 or the user interface, but having used older desks and found them a pile of poo and also having used a d5 which is a fantastic desk but is an 8 man lift and not suitable for conference (however the most useful feature in the world ever is the digitally legendable pfl buttons - no more white tape needed!!!)

 

for a theatre show - with a large number of cues that always happen in the same order or for a large band tour, where different effects eq settings can be used per track inorder to recreate the studio sound then digital is great. even for smaller band gigs where there are multiple bands - who can have a page each...

but in my opinion for 1 off events and conferences digital desks take longer to set up each time and thats where my opinion comes from...

 

paul...

[James]

Paul

 

I agree with you, digital desks have their place. That is why I cary digital and analouge desks in my invantory,

 

Just two points while I'm in a pedantary mood.

 

The DDX3216 has a row of encoders enabling you to affect the balance on more than one channel at the same time.

 

Personaly I like being able to "preset" a yamaha desk on the laptop before arriving in the venue which is something useful for conferences where you need interesting foldback or record routing and where I/p o/p labling comes in very useful.

 

James