Musical Theatre productions – questions of curiosity

[S&L]

Musical Theatre productions – questions of curiosity

 

As some one with both feet planted firmly in the live rock music tradition, I have had some curiosity regarding the sound for amateur theatre at the higher levels (think town and city venues rather than village halls). I have seen a couple of productions in last six months with varying results. All seem to use wireless headset mics and digital desks (I’m an old analogue man) all are on limited run of 4 or 5 days, so I imagine not much time in house to prepare – I understand each company tends to have their own favoured amateur sound engineer at the desk. The set up’s would seem to be more complex than for a rock gig that I would mix for, hence my curiosity. If anyone feels like responding to my curiosity my questions are as follows:

 

Does each head set have its own receiver unit, is the receiver unit stage side or at the front of house position and how do you resolve running maybe 24 radio mics at once. One assumes this is a standard solution, since all the productions I see use them.

 

Cues. For a rock set I may have a couple of dozen songs with 2 or 3 cues per song so that’s maybe 100 cues in total – but they are repetitive in nature – vocal on/off, guitar up/down etc. I saw a production of les mis recently and lost count of the vocal cues at over 100 in the first half hour – now on the night the guy missed some cues but got most of them and the production of guys and dolls I saw (admittedly simpler) was absolutely flawless in balance and muting. How do you keep track of all the vocal cues?

 

When I am looking after 2 or 3 vocal mics, I would usually ‘treat’ the primary vocal, particularly if it is female, it may be gated, compressed, it will definitely be eq’ed and have it’s own reverb. I may just use differing degrees of send for all the vocals to these. Do you ‘treat’ all 24 (or however many) musical theatre mics similarly and do you do them separately or with a one setting fits all? Presumably this is easier with a digital desk with some of this stuff on board but the same question applies in theory – do you individually program the mic settings or do you do a ‘one size fits all’ setting.

 

As I say, just curiosity and more than a little naivety but you often learn more about your own job by knowing how different people do different jobs and you never stop learning!

 

 

[paulears]

No - you're pretty correct really - digital desks, especially the yamahas do help when you have many mics on the go, and yes, individual eq and effects - as appropriate. I tend to think of sound effects and other sounds being played in at specific times a cues, and the rest as continual balancing - with the script. everyone has their own way of doing it, but in essence, it's simply a case of bringing mics in and out as the script dictates - for the big chorus numbers you can pull or push individuals as needed. Amateurs often find they don't have budget for everyone to be miked, so often there will be a degree of swapping between the lesser characters.

[S&L]

No - you're pretty correct really - digital desks, especially the yamahas do help when you have many mics on the go, and yes, individual eq and effects - as appropriate. I tend to think of sound effects and other sounds being played in at specific times a cues, and the rest as continual balancing - with the script. everyone has their own way of doing it, but in essence, it's simply a case of bringing mics in and out as the script dictates - for the big chorus numbers you can pull or push individuals as needed. Amateurs often find they don't have budget for everyone to be miked, so often there will be a degree of swapping between the lesser characters.

 

so how would you keep track of something like les mis with a dozen principal mic's cueing in and out all the time? do you work with a cue sheet or the score? or just learn it really fast? When mixing rock I tend to get in a habit of always plutting inputs in a certian order then I know where to find them at each gig..so principal vocal mic would usually be chanel 1, backing vocals, 2, 3 and so on and then I work the backline in sequence left to right...and then I label them up if time permits. how do you remember which one of the vocal faders to un-mute at the right time?

[Shez]

Pretty much by knowing the script. It starts off as an aide memoir but by the first night, you should pretty much know the whole show.

It's not the kind of gig you can just walk up to - there's a LOT of prep to be done before you get in to the venue. Getting familiar with the script and marking entrances/exits or first lines/last lines is just the start of it.

[paulears]

I tend to mark the script with big +6, -1, +5,7,8 at the point it needs to happen, and then at the top of every page have a left to right list of those active at this point - so if you get lost, you can quickly see which fader you forgot to drop. Some people leave the faders and use the mutes instead. If complex bits appear at the top of a page turn, I'll give myself a s/by cue i.e. SBY4 so I have a finger on it. With a busy script, an assistant is great to look after the music balance and sfx is pretty essential. If you're doing a really big show, then you might need to also think about mixing so the audience can use their ears to place voices on stage. so you have left to right panning, AND changes in eq and/or reverb to assist the localisation - and that's a big step, when automation becomes very important. In general, many people tend to mix vocals mono, perhaps giving a bit of a split on those duets where the turns are spaced left and right.

 

The only other thing is that cleverer mixers let you group things up to make mixing easier. Not just digital ones, but the established older analogue musical theatre types like the Cadacs, popular for years - where you could bring in your more distant faders to the central position for ease of operation, and then swap them for others as the show progressed. Programmable groups, midi muting and full automation have all been tried with varying degrees of success. The digital desks, with their motorised faders and scene recall should make totally programmed shows possible, like the lighting people have had for years, but actors mess this up by forgetting to speak or sing, or doing it too early when you weren't expecting it, or singing louder or quieter as their voice demands. Clicks, pops and horrible problems are a constant battle - nursing sick microphones through the show or until a swap point comes along. On top of this, amateurs may not have somebody onstage with the receiver racks - this job in the big musicals means somebody will be monitoring the batteries and the RF and audio levels, and can listen in to check that people really are ready. Watching the audio level on a channel suddenly drop to zero can mean two things - first and worst is that the mic has died, the pack is working and something needs sorting quickly. Plugs come loose, cables get broken or ripped out sometimes by excessive physical activity. On the other hand, they could just be waiting behind a flat, for their entrance and not making a noise. If you are running with one op in a busy show, although you could listen in and check, if you don't hear anything have your really got time to get on the headset, tell somebody backstage and have them fix it before their entrance - and keep the current ones on stage balanced? It's common backstage to even hear the DSM ask Miss Smith if she could walk into the corridor to check her mic - because the dressing room was just too far away from the stage and the sound man couldn't be sure it was working. Other problems may well be that the sound man panaics because he can hear dressing room or green room sound, which indicates the artiste is NOT standing in the wings waiting to enter, and shoving the fader is going to result in the audience hearing the end of a dirty joke!

 

Some people (your first question) do have the receiver racks front of house, but this means extra distance between the packs and the receivers, and I personally won't do this - I'd rather lose the info on the panels and have more signal strength.

 

What is absolutely certain is that foh duty in a musical is NOT a sit back and have an easy time job. Mistakes come from losing concentration - pure and simple.

[S&L]

I was impressed by what I guessed was going on before I knew all the detail and now I have more insight I really truly am impressed - it makes a rock gig a picnic by comparison. thanks for the detailed reply Paul - it's also made me think about tightening up my rock gig procedure with a similar +6, -1, +5. SYB4 schedule... while catering for the inevitable ad libs and Jams!

Moderation: quote not needed - removed

[paulears]

I suspect that sometimes the amateurs actually have a more difficult job because there are so many things that can only be improved with experience and if they do tow or three shows a year max, then it takes a long time to build the experience.

 

Budgets for even pro shows don't always allow you the luxury of more than one sound person - so stage sound duties may get done by the general LX crew. I don't do so much actual operating for my work now - probably about half an half, but being the interfering person that I am, when I'm company manager, I use an in-ear so I can keep in touch with the show comms, and hearing the sound mans voice come up, usually has me heading for the stage - because the fact he's put the cans on means something is going wrong. Usually I'll hear him ask the DSM to check so and so's mic when he comes off - pops and bangs were this years plague in one production. mini-XLRs coming unplugged during physical scenes, and the plug in headset cables coming slightly loose where it plugs into the boom mic behind the ear. So in many cases, I'd be there to thrust a hand down somebodies trousers or suddenly apply two hands to somebodies neck area. Finding a member of the LX crew and explaining what is wrong takes time, and I really wish we had money for an A2 or even a technical ASM. Being able to put a pair of headphones plugged into the radio rack on, and having a listen to see if the crackles re-appear is really important. In the big budget London shows, then 3 members of the audio team mean there are enough physical people to cover all the corners, but outside of the big money league, the operator count drops rapidly.

[Bobbsy]

As you're probably guessing, everyone has a slightly different way of working to achieve the same things.

 

Personally, I like having the radio mic receivers at my end (giving me access to to things like battery life and RF level readouts) and tend to use low loss cable (from the satellite industry) to place the antennas nearer the stage. I also had a set of Sony active antennae which provided head amplification right a the antenna. However, the venue I presently work in has a standard of having their receiver rack near the prompt desk and letting the A2 do any monitoring and checking. Either can work.

 

As for cues, like others I have a marked up script that includes stand by notes for all entrances, notes as to where to dip or boost a mic, where to favour a soloist and back off the chorus and so on. However, I try to have the show memorised before the first audience gets in and use the marked script only as an "aide memorire". Most often I flick ahead a page or two to see what's coming up next just to check the cue line and so on. Even if I have the script well memorised, I try to force myself to "look ahead" just to make sure I don't forget something.

 

Yes, digital desks with scene pre-sets are great for theatre work. I can have the desk mainly programmed before I even get to the theatre. However, it's still necessary to use the presets only as a guide and "mix by ear". Every performance is slightly different in terms of the energy from the cast and orchestra. In my case I tend to set all my presets a few dB lower than the expected level and tweak by listening .

 

However, some of my favourite shows have been done on analogue desks without any automation--digital just makes it a bit easier.

 

One other aspect to remember is that theatre sound is also full of sound effects. For me, this can be the most creative aspect of the job. While the cast are rehearsing, I'm often recording and mixing all the extra sounds needed, whether it's an occasional crack of lightning or a low level sound scape that runs for a whole act. I once did a show where the entire second act took place on a formation of aircraft and had an aircraft drone that ran for over an hour, sometimes at a subliminal level and other times crept in to be quite loud. There was a dramatic point where the aircraft sound suddenly died and, since the audience was used to it, the sudden disappearance really worked well.

 

Bob

[tolley1466]

Pretty much by knowing the script. It starts off as an aide memoir but by the first night, you should pretty much know the whole show.

It's not the kind of gig you can just walk up to - there's a LOT of prep to be done before you get in to the venue. Getting familiar with the script and marking entrances/exits or first lines/last lines is just the start of it.

 

Also if using a digital desk, snapshots help a lot with big shows where a lot is going on. So you would recall this snapshot that has been pre-programmed and named something relevant to the action or scene. For example if there was a scene where I had 6 people coming off stage and 2 people staying on for a duo I could program those exiting mics to mute and the two other microphones to stay on with the backing track/band.

[neilalexrose]

If you (or anyone) is interested, I've uploaded a PDF of my panto paperwork from 2009. I just thought it would be easier to refer to, than trying to describe my madness and method! The desk I get is a soundcraft Vi4, and the layout (and colours) of my paperwork reflects this, the radiomic channels are to the right of the centre VCA/Master mixing section, thus keeping them close to me. The primary band channels are also close by to the left, along with track and SFX faders. Channels I don't need access to, like effects processors go on the second layer.

Snapshots/cues, are used to change the VCA routing and RX mutes. Thanks to electronic legends above the faders you can always see which characters you are controlling. This way it keeps all the characters close under you fingers, so you don't have to go reaching to the other end of the desk for one line!

I only have 8 mics to deal with, thankfully, which means that the number of snapshots isn't as high as a musical with a larger cast. Snapshot changes only really happen at the end of scenes, or for a song. It's only towards the end of the show that you get all 8 mics on stage, and in order not to run out of VCA faders (there are 8 on the Vi4), that's when snapshot changes become more frequent, as I always like to keep the band on a fader.

 

Radio Receivers go on stage - Multi run to FOH and length of ariel cable dictates this.

In terms of processing vocal mics, a lot of it has to do with getting the best mic position to start with (centre forehead is the best and most natural sounding place to start), but this depends a lot on the type of mics used, headsets, or small omnidirectional capsules seem to be the norm at the moment. I've only ever worked with omnidirectional capsules, so can't comment on headset mics. If you get a good natural sound to start with, you shouldn't need to treat the mic too much, only a little correction here and there to keep control. You obviously have a soundcheck, but a lot of the work gets done during rehearsals, as costumes and headgear can often throw up nasty surprises that will affect the sound. (hats in particular can really prove a problem!)

 

Script wise, I mark entrances and exits of characters, but just try and learn the lines and show as quickly as possible. Primarily mixed by ear, but obviously Vocals get louder or quieter as performers have a bad day, or once you get a loud audience in. I write down band and track levels in the script during sound check, but again, as the show develops over time, these levels will change.

 

The paperwork I try and produce before I get to rehearsals, and I pre-program as much as I can with regards to sound effects and show control, and program the sound desk snapshots using the offline editor. Makes for a smoother, and quicker fit up and tech if everything is prepared and ready to go.

 

HTH

 

Neil

[TimmyP1955]

For theater, if analog, one would a console that can have a large number of mute groups and the ability to program a large stack of mute scenes. If digital, just a lot of scenes (where anything can be changed, not just channel on/off). We typically have 125 to 150 scenes for a play (we use an LS9). It takes some time to set them up and mark the script, but during the show the operator just follows the script and hits the 'recall up' button when his notes tell him to (or he can get someone else to follow the script and tell him when to push the button :-)

[chelgrian]

For theater, if analog, one would a console that can have a large number of mute groups and the ability to program a large stack of mute scenes. If digital, just a lot of scenes (where anything can be changed, not just channel on/off). We typically have 125 to 150 scenes for a play (we use an LS9). It takes some time to set them up and mark the script, but during the show the operator just follows the script and hits the 'recall up' button when his notes tell him to (or he can get someone else to follow the script and tell him when to push the button :-)

 

The Yamaha automation system is useless for musical theatre as it saves the entire state of the desk in absolute terms. In a lot of cases if want to change something you have to go and change it in every scene. It just about works for mute automation with every other parameter set to recall safe. However given I usually only have a maximum of 12 ways of radio it's easier just to mix on the faders. I use the scene memory just to save the state of the desk as a backup.

 

In Yamaha terms you have to go up to the PM5D before you get anything useful and even then it's not very good as it's a 'tracking recall' feature rather than the desk doing automation by tracking deltas between scenes.

 

In terms of radio receivers I usually have them in the box (small theatre so distance is not a problem) I'm currently playing with having a laptop on the radio mic runner's desk running the Sennheiser WSM software so the runner can see what is going on.

 

To second what paulears said musical theatre comes down to just knowing what is going to happen next. You have to be able to mix by touch, if you have to think about what to do then you can't give your concentration to the sound mix itself.

 

Amateur shows that are produced, run and struck within one week are even harder as you only get once chance to practice mixing it at the dress rehearsal as usually that's the first time you see the band. I generally spend the dress and perhaps the first night mixing with reference to a score after that it's just done from memory. It's also the most thankless task in the theatre as if you are doing your job properly Joe Public should not even realise you are there.

[S&L]

It's also the most thankless task in the theatre as if you are doing your job properly Joe Public should not even realise you are there.

I guess that's what I was thinking in terms of the production I had seen recently compaired to other previous amateur productions. I was stunned by the seemlessness especially compaired to previous amateur productions I had seen...and that made me curious as to how things worked compaired with my (much more simple) rock world. I'm in deep as a part timer workign analogue, I'm deeply impressed by all of you! thanks for all the information it all helps the learning curve and there are lessons here I can apply in quest for the perfect rock show too.

[JackBrienLX]

Just thought I would add my 2p from touring musical sounds world, some of it has been covered before above..

 

Firstly about radio mics, the receivers always go as close as possible to the stage, this reduces antenna cable runs and is easier to fix should something go wrong, you will have a sound No.2 and sometimes 3/4 who's responsibility it is to look after these mics, both by monitoring audio and checking positioning on cast members.. And then obviously fixing any problems. It is not unusual to have over 40 ways of radio on a large touring show as the main characters will usually be double mic and packed as a main and backup system. Each mic (DPA 4060 / 61's for example) is painted to blend in with performers hair / wigs or whatever their surroundings may be, it is not unusual to have separate mics and packs for hats with peaks as this obviously changes the acoustic environment of the mic, and also threaded down people's legs for tap noises in tap dancing numbers. Sound No.2 can be a very stressful job, especially when you are trying to change a characters mic, which is under several layers of costume and wigs, in their quick change (which can be as quick as 30 seconds or less).

 

On top of radio mics you can have several reverse radio systems with batteries and speakers to make sound effects literally come out of props / scenery.

 

It is also worth noting that the sound department will be looking after all wireless comms, wired comms, motorolas and their integration into the other sets, video and safety cameras, cue lights and audio / video monitors. For every department and every band member. Sometimes you have to prioritise between a characters mics dying and the MD's monitors dying.. Which ever one you choose the other will be really pissed! Best bit of advice I ever got was "Sound is 90% PR 10% PA"!

 

As far as the mixing goes, yes you have to know every word of the script by heart, along with every cue and sound effect, you do it off script to begin with but this is just another thing to keep track of, and what happens when your first cover goes on and forgets the script! The desks are automated via the DCA (or VCA's!) which brings the mic you need to you in the centre of the console, obviously no one expects you to be able to put 24 mics up for ensemble singing individually, you will get boys / girls faders usually and then mix the individual members (who may be having a loud or quiet day) on their input faders. These then outputted via fairly complex mix and matrix systems to allow you to image principle vocals very close to stage but making ensemble vocals more general for example.

 

Mixing is also stressful as you dont want to be the guy that dropped a line and ruined a crucial moment of the show for a few thousand people! If a mic dies you have to hope you have a good no.2 and in the mean time make do by picking the person up on other people's lines.. I once had a discussion with a member of cast who was adamant that if her mic died then I should just let her project as it was more off putting.. I explained that she could not project over a 10 piece orchestra even at underscore level to the back row at Edinburgh playhouse and she finally understood!

 

All of this whilst having a designer, director and producer barking orders at you during tech periods can make it a fun filled time for all!

 

With all of this the job gets infinitely easier, as always, with a good touring sound team, good PSE's / freelancers and good crew!

 

On s separate note, and hopefully not one that will open up a big can of worms! This is the kind of stuff I would of expected to be taught had I gone to drama school and study sound.. However I am meeting more and more students and work experience people who have spent 3 years in a studio and had no idea any of this went on! I'm thinking of sending an email around at some point inviting people down for a site visit when whatever show I am on is in town, so they might get a bit more of an idea. (this isn't directed at any estableshemt in particular as I know several very good freelancers and engineers who do teach this stuff very well in-between their own gigs!). And on the flip side I have never done rock and roll so would be very interested to see the other side of things as it were, I'm sure I could learn a lot!

 

Apologies for any spelling errors, I am trying out my new gadget and getting used to the keyboard!

 

Jack

[Gareth Owen]

The Yamaha automation system is useless for musical theatre as it saves the entire state of the desk in absolute terms. In a lot of cases if want to change something you have to go and change it in every scene. It just about works for mute automation with every other parameter set to recall safe. However given I usually only have a maximum of 12 ways of radio it's easier just to mix on the faders. I use the scene memory just to save the state of the desk as a backup.

 

In Yamaha terms you have to go up to the PM5D before you get anything useful and even then it's not very good as it's a 'tracking recall' feature rather than the desk doing automation by tracking deltas between scenes.

Umm, now, I promise I'm not trying to pick a argument here, but to say Yamaha automation is useless for musical theatre is rather a sweeping statement, not least because its not very accurate.

 

Current touring musical theatre shows out on Yamaha desks include Blood Brothers, Starlight Express, Dreamboats & Petticoats, Evita, Jekyll & Hyde, and Sound of Music. Current west end shows on Yamaha desks include Phantom of the Opera, Road Show, Priscilla Queen of the Desert, Dreamboats & Petticoats and Blood Brothers.

 

You are correct to suggest that the console saves the entire state in absolute terms, but, to be honest, so do all the other popular theatre desks - I'm thinking DigiCo and DigiDesign here. In most cases you store everything and then decide what you want to recall on a scene by scene basis. Setting up an appropriate Recall Safe Mask before you begin programming can be tricky and requires a bit of forward planning but any Yamaha desk, in my humble opinion, can be used most successfully for musical theatre.