Martin Roboscan 518 problem

[fireball40k]

I have recently taken on four Martin 518 units and three are fine while the fourth is a little temperamental.

 

When operating under DMX, she starts up and does the usual clunking of pan and tilt steppers and then turns the mirror to the front to signal readiness - the other three stay like this until you tell them what to do - but the temperamental one then almost immediately pans the mirror all the way to the right side and remains there. All attempts to lamp on via DMX are ignored. However, if I switch off, take her out of DMX mode and put her into forced 'lamp on' mode using the switches (8 and 10 on), when power is reapplied, she strikes up.

 

When I first did this and then switched her back to DMX, she worked fine. However, today she has gone back to her bad ways and even though the DIP switch induced 'lamp on' makes her ignite, when I go back to DMX mode (after waiting a further ten minutes for the lamp to recover), she doesn't want to know.

 

I daren't attempt a show with these until I get to the bottom of what's causing the behaviour. It doesn't seem to be an ignitor problem, it seems more on the logic/control side but why would that be so hit and miss? BTW These are the later versions with MSD 250/2 lamps.

 

If anyone recognises the symptoms and has any pointers on what to look for I would be most grateful.

 

Cheers guys

[Caldair]

That sounds like it's on the wrong DMX adress...? :D (Or in the console's patch.)

[fireball40k]

That sounds like it's on the wrong DMX adress...? :) (Or in the console's patch.)

I'm certain that the DMX settings are fine. When it's having a good day, it works fine with the DMX address settings that it has and the way that the desk is sending data. On its bad days, the self test fails before even getting to the DMX stage. This is an internal problem with the unit somewhere. I'm guessing that the turning of the mirror to the side is its way of signalling any of a whole range of errors found during self test, so it's a matter of finding the item that's at fault. Does anyone have a tried and tested fault finding procedure for these?

[Tin]

I have recently taken on four Martin 518 units and three are fine while the fourth is a little temperamental.

 

When operating under DMX, she starts up and does the usual clunking of pan and tilt steppers and then turns the mirror to the front to signal readiness - the other three stay like this until you tell them what to do - but the temperamental one then almost immediately pans the mirror all the way to the right side and remains there. All attempts to lamp on via DMX are ignored. However, if I switch off, take her out of DMX mode and put her into forced 'lamp on' mode using the switches (8 and 10 on), when power is reapplied, she strikes up.

 

When I first did this and then switched her back to DMX, she worked fine. However, today she has gone back to her bad ways and even though the DIP switch induced 'lamp on' makes her ignite, when I go back to DMX mode (after waiting a further ten minutes for the lamp to recover), she doesn't want to know.

 

I daren't attempt a show with these until I get to the bottom of what's causing the behaviour. It doesn't seem to be an ignitor problem, it seems more on the logic/control side but why would that be so hit and miss? BTW These are the later versions with MSD 250/2 lamps.

 

If anyone recognises the symptoms and has any pointers on what to look for I would be most grateful.

 

Cheers guys

 

Hi

 

The Dip Switches in these units can become faulty, either by bad contact or dry joints, therefore misleading as to what DMX address or any other settings the unit is set to!

A quick clean of the switch's contacts with IPA and re-soldering of the pins could fix the problem.

[KevinE]

Agree with Tin, the fans on these seem to be good at drawing squalid air over the DIP switches. It can also rot the tracks away under the switch, (from seeing these in sweaty nightlcubs), I'd say sweat laden air is a little acidic maybe?

[LXbydesign]

When operating under DMX, she starts up and does the usual .......

 

I didnt know they were female?!!

[fireball40k]

The DIP switches seem to be a possibility. The other night I got her going on a previously known good DMX address setting and the channels seemed mixed up, like it was one or two address locations out. This could be a distinct sign that the switch block is faulty.

 

Martin head office also mentioned the possibility of the gobo/colour wheel sensors not getting their signals back to the controller as another possible cause. However, the wheels were finding their register so it wasn't that (they would keep spinning after the self test if there was a problem). I mention this just as a matter of record for any others who experience similar problems in the future.

 

I will report back on the DIP switch question - Thanks Tin and KevinE.

 

SHE is the temperamental one of the bunch, what can I say? I need to find her some Danish HRT patches.

[stgtech]

I didnt know they were female?!! :)

 

Roboscan Series:

It never does what its supposed to and, if it does, it does so with a lot of noise and whining. How could it not be a she?

 

:** laughs out loud **:

[royzinrotherham]

Having recently stripped out of a night club 30 fittings , 70% of all the faults were caused by the dip switch block , just because the pin is up/down dont assume it actually has done the switching .

[fireball40k]

Having recently stripped out of a night club 30 fittings , 70% of all the faults were caused by the dip switch block , just because the pin is up/down dont assume it actually has done the switching .

 

Are you getting rid of any? I could do with a spare

[dmxtothemax]

When the martin lights are first turned on, before the lamp strikes, the unit will go thru a test proceedure, and it tests that all of the stepper motors are working and responding as they should, as your light appears to have a problem in this area, the unit is failing the self test proceedure and there fore not proceeding to the next step, which would be lamp strke up.

martins are well known for problems with the position sensors.it seems that the heat evenually just cooks the sensors. so the first thing I would check is the sensors. if you swap some sensors from a working light it will prove the point, also check for dirt and dust build up under the circuit boards, another common problem with martins, which can cause eratic behaviour.

please let us know when you find the problem.

 

I have recently taken on four Martin 518 units and three are fine while the fourth is a little temperamental.

 

When operating under DMX, she starts up and does the usual clunking of pan and tilt steppers and then turns the mirror to the front to signal readiness - the other three stay like this until you tell them what to do - but the temperamental one then almost immediately pans the mirror all the way to the right side and remains there. All attempts to lamp on via DMX are ignored. However, if I switch off, take her out of DMX mode and put her into forced 'lamp on' mode using the switches (8 and 10 on), when power is reapplied, she strikes up.

 

When I first did this and then switched her back to DMX, she worked fine. However, today she has gone back to her bad ways and even though the DIP switch induced 'lamp on' makes her ignite, when I go back to DMX mode (after waiting a further ten minutes for the lamp to recover), she doesn't want to know.

 

I daren't attempt a show with these until I get to the bottom of what's causing the behaviour. It doesn't seem to be an ignitor problem, it seems more on the logic/control side but why would that be so hit and miss? BTW These are the later versions with MSD 250/2 lamps.

 

If anyone recognises the symptoms and has any pointers on what to look for I would be most grateful.

 

Cheers guys

[fireball40k]

When the martin lights are first turned on, before the lamp strikes, the unit will go thru a test proceedure, and it tests that all of the stepper motors are working and responding as they should, as your light appears to have a problem in this area, the unit is failing the self test proceedure and there fore not proceeding to the next step, which would be lamp strke up.

martins are well known for problems with the position sensors.it seems that the heat evenually just cooks the sensors. so the first thing I would check is the sensors. if you swap some sensors from a working light it will prove the point, also check for dirt and dust build up under the circuit boards, another common problem with martins, which can cause eratic behaviour.

please let us know when you find the problem.

 

I still have not completely got to the bottom of this due to a lack of time, but I did replace the DIP switch block over the weekend on the worst performer and it didn't really have any effect. Although I then found that if that unit is given a lower DMX address (e.g. at DMX 001 or 010) then it performs OK. In changing them and their addresses around like this to get all four operating as a team on consecutive addresses, I then found that one of the other, previously 'happy' units, didn't want to live at the higher DMX address either! This seems weird at first glance but maybe a similar addressing track (from sw 4 or 5) on the PCB from the DIP switch block has suffered a similar problem? The problems seem to manifest themselves either immediately after the startup checks or during the first few minutes of operation. Either way it swings the mirror over to the right like a sulky child and refuses to play. I just need more time to keep trying different combinations to narrow down the possibilities - either that or I'm going to take a hammer to these *&%$£# things in a sudden fit of rage. While I had the circuit board out, I gave it a good visual going over and couldn't see anything obvious and it was not gunked up with fog fluid residue.

 

Regarding the positioning sensors that you mention, the only feedback sensors that are obvious are the ones on the colour and gobo wheels. These are hall effect units (not the earlier opto types) and appear to be working because otherwise the wheels would just keep spinning. (BTW: Martin also said that if you get the problem with the wheels spinning and need to determine whether it's the sensors/cable or the controller; remove the sensor cable from the PCB and join the outer two of the three pins of the connector - if the wheel stops, then its your sensor/cable, if it doesn't then it's the controller). Do you know whether the positioning steppers have their own internal sensors? I just assumed that they were driven blind without feedback and that after banging them against their stops for a few seconds, the controller just assumed that they were in the correct starting position. The cable feeds to the steppers have only four wires, which would all be needed for positioning control as far as I can tell, but please let me know if you have more detail on this.

 

If anyone has circuit diagrams or any other technical literature on these units, I would be most grateful for all the ammunition that I can get in this little private war that I am waging on their geriatric tardiness. They are providing me with a good introduction to moving lights, although it would be nice to concentrate on the programming side and not all on getting them working. I am determined that they will be used to provide sweeping beams coming forward through the mist, from behind the drummer's head, in at least one show! After that, who knows?

 

For the moment I remain perplexed.