PA Hire

[stevejones]

Hi

 

I'm getting a few enquires to hire out my PA

Nexo PS10, MA 1.4, Crest 1K into Sub and Allen & Heath Desk

 

Any thoughts on a fir price, with / without Engineering

 

It's not a commercial concern but it would help to pay for itself

 

any thoughts much appreciated

[Doug Siddons]

There is a formula for working out rates based on total cost of the equipment depreciation insurance testing costs transport and your time but in the real world it depends where you are, how much you value your time and equipment, and what the competition is charging. Check out local hire companies see what they would charge for a similar rig and use that. Make sure that whoever hires it realises the cost of replacing bits if they break them.

[Rob_Beech]

There is a formula for working out rates based on total cost of the equipment depreciation insurance testing costs transport and your time but in the real world it depends where you are, how much you value your time and equipment, and what the competition is charging. Check out local hire companies see what they would charge for a similar rig and use that. Make sure that whoever hires it realises the cost of replacing bits if they break them.

Location is important here. Around here you'd be lucky to get £50 per day for it. Other areas you may well get more. Engineers rates vary too much to comment.

[benhyman]

Location is important here. Around here you'd be lucky to get £50 per day for it. Other areas you may well get more. Engineers rates vary too much to comment.

 

£50!? Don't you just love people that de-value the industry...

[Rob_Beech]

So I'm de-valuing the industry now am I?

 

If you spent as much time as I do battling against arseholes that'll put an entire pa out with engineers for £200 a night then perhaps you'd understand why things need to be competitively priced. You'll notice my website is competitively priced because it has to be.

 

Perhaps I should charge more than £25 a box for aspect wide or more than £150 for 4 stacks with amps. But quite frankly it would have half an inch of dust on it right now in this part of the world.

 

So, to the blue room. Apologies for de valuing our industry, I'll refrain from trying to help in the future.

 

Now back to my tour.

[tolley1466]

From the hire prices I've seen, I'd say £50 is about right for 2 PS10s and an LS600... Excluding amps and controllers that is.

[StevenW2]

Last week I quoted a small dry hire of a similar system - A&H desk, 2 vocal mics & stands, 2 x DIs for acoustic guitars, amp, controller, speakers, stand & cables - you know the sort of small rig.

 

My quote was £80 + VAT for kit with an insurance value of over £8,000 + VAT.

 

The guy just laughed over the phone and said I would have to beat £30 cash!

 

These are difficult times.............

[Unfathomable]

Last week I quoted a small dry hire of a similar system - A&H desk, 2 vocal mics & stands, 2 x DIs for acoustic guitars, amp, controller, speakers, stand & cables - you know the sort of small rig.

 

My quote was £80 + VAT for kit with an insurance value of over £8,000 + VAT.

 

The guy just laughed over the phone and said I would have to beat £30 cash!

 

These are difficult times.............

 

I am struggling to beat people who own a small, low quality set-up and for whom it is not their main income. (It is not really my main income, but since I only work Part time, it would be nice if it was).

 

I charge based on most of the things above, but I always try to make it clear exactly what the cost breaks down to and what their money is getting them.

[stevejones]

seems like a can of worms has been opened

 

I do appreciate the comments though and whilst it's not my main source of income it's still £8K worth of reasonably proper kit

 

We're pretty much cow country this neck of the woods so I'm not prepared to compete with the £30 cash guys and have decided to do no dry hire unless it's a band I know can be trusted

 

Thanks for all your comments

[pumpkinhead456]

We're pretty much cow country this neck of the woods so I'm not prepared to compete with the £30 cash guys and have decided to do no dry hire unless it's a band I know can be trusted

 

Good call!

I too live in cow country, all be it with a little competition! We can charge £100 a night for an HK Actor rig, with monitors and mixers for a DJ set up (including set up and delivery). A fully engineered band in our biggest local venue (about 450 standing) with all the bells an whistles (7.5k foh, 4k monitors, a few lights etc) can see a typical return of £400 a night. At a push we are doing £1000 a month after 9 months of hiring, which is perfect for us (me and my mate both have good jobs as a main income). The reason we keep getting work is we go that extra mile or two to make sure things are perfect; our competition is generally fedup and it shows through their attitude!

[Rob_Beech]

To be fair they're probably fed up of people putting out a complete system with lights out for £400.

 

What are your overheads like? How much do your business rates costs? Your equipment insurance? and your PLI?

The issue is that you CAN charge £400 as it's pocket money. Your other jobs put food on the table. So for those people who put food on the table with a job in THIS industry, they no longer have any work.

 

If people who get their main income from this have to compete, then they' have to offer the same service for less, or more service for the same money. This would mean they'd have to LIVE on £1000 a month between 2 of them. Could YOU LIVE on that figure? This is what you are making others do.

 

 

I'm a SMALL company that does it properly and £1000 a month doesn't cover my expenses, and there are no loans etc.

[ChrisBogg]

I agree Rob.

 

I think Ben's Post above if taken in another context. can be partly true.

 

We live in an industry now that is solely based on price. We (myself and your good self) are both forced to as ben puts it, de-value our industry or our products to be competitive with the companies with no overheads insurance etc.

 

I try as best as I can not to enter into price wars with local companies as I truly believe that I offer a better service for the money I charge, however this is near enough impossible on dry hire work as many clients don't see the standard of prep and emergency response time/phone advice as being part of this superior service.

 

I would love to work in a world where every client genuinely used our services because they new that I would go the extra mile even on a dry hire to ensure that their event was a success however many dry hire clients would in my experience cancel a hire and go up the road for a tenner!

 

I to don't do a great deal of dry hire out side of company sub hires for this reason.

 

Chris

[mervaka]

to be honest, I'd love to be able to charge more. but for what I do, the client's just don't have the spending power for anything more. instead I cut corners on what I load in, what mics I put out, etc. it's a pain in the backside working alone, so I make the job easier for myself if I can't be paid for it.

[Paul J Need]

Yup the audio hire market is very tough!

 

So many people with a bit of kit, all after the same number of small jobs. We've stopped quoting jobs now when someone calls up and asks for example: a 10k rig with 12 monitor mix, XL3 FOH, 3 sound crew and 7.5T truck to move it - they are expecting a quote of around £600 all in!!!

 

In reply to the OP - do some shopping around your area - if you can fine a place within 10 miles and your prices are the same; your customer will 'probably come to you'

 

If it's not meant to be a commercial venture - charge what you think the hire is worth is you had to hire it yourself and quote this. If they say no - you've lost nothing, if they say yes........ bingo

 

Just make sure your kit is PAT tested, insured and go through all the usual hire routine including writing your terms of hire in case some thing goes wrong.

[Pete McCrea]

It's not a commercial concern but it would help to pay for itself

 

any thoughts much appreciated

But it is. Not necessarilly in the form of a LTD Company, but it is additional income that I assume you are informing HMRC of on your tax return right?

 

And then you have the duty of care- you hire out a piece of the system. It kills someone through an electric shock. I assume you have undertaken your responsibilities under the relevant laws, and have a traceable system that shows that the equipment had been inspected and found safe right? You also have it insured so if someone knicks it whilst on hire you can replace it. And I'm not sure that your typical DJ/Music Guard insurance will cover it when dry hired out. And again you took a copy of their Drivers Licence and a utility bill to ensure your upt to speed so the insurance company can they pay out....

 

I have nothing against people starting new businesses. I do have issues with cowboys though. If you can keep storage down, then fair enough. Insurance is your call on the risk. Electrical safety is paramount.

 

As others have said though, see what you can get locally and price accordingly.