Newbie Question

[Latchy]

Hello,

 

I have always wondered at the live shows what those things where in there ears. I found out, its a Monitoring System. But what I dont know is what are they actually hearing though those ear phones?

 

Rob

[tolley1466]

Hi Rob,

First off - Welcome to the Blue Room :]

 

In reply to your question, it's totally up to the proformer. It would usually be a simualar mix though the foldbacks...

It can depend on the application though. Say broadcast, the operator may give cues to the presenter etc.

 

I'm sure other posters will go into greater detail...

Ryan.

[Latchy]

Thanks for your reply Ryan. What do you mean by 'simulator mix though the foldbacks'. As I said, I am a newbie. I know the basics but thats about it for sound. I'm more of a Lighting technician :-D (still need help from time to time)

 

Rob

[johndenim]

Ryan, as this is a pretty 'newbie' question words like 'foldback' are not really going to help.

 

Basically Rob they are headphones, the performer can chose what he wants to hear.

If it's a vocalist with a band, he/she can ask for a certain mix. (I.e their own voice, and band)

Different singers require different things.

If it's moulded IEM's (In Ear Monitors) that you have seen, the wearer is completly isolated from any sound other than what's coming through the 'headphones', so the vocalist has to know what is going on, usually they hear themselves and the band a little lower, reverb or 'echo' on the singers vocals is their choice.

[Latchy]

Thanks John, I understand now.

 

Rob

[Killyp]

FWIW, they serve the same function as the 'wedge' shaped speakers you often see on the stage pointing at the performers, but the advantage of IEMs is that they don't spill sound into the microphones, so you don't get any feedback.

[paulears]

The other reason you see so many people using them nowadays is that they are better for your long term hearing. A big problem on stage is that a few feet behind the singer will be some bloke bashing all hell out of the drums. So the singer may need one or two floor mounted loudspeakers to make their voice loud enough to get over the drums. If they cannot hear themselves, they cannot pitch properly. Off to one side will be the bass and guitars, along with keyboards plus maybe even a few trumpets, trombones, sax players etc etc. Each one of these needs to hear too, so they get monitors as well. On bigger systems, each person has their own mix - so maybe the bass player wants drums, as they play as a team - BUT the bass player doesn't want the keyboards because they confuse each other. The main singer might need the guitar as well as their own voice, but not the drums - very soon it gets very very complicated. All these loudspeakers get turned up and up. When the singer asks for more guitar, they really mean less of everything else - but as 'everything else' is a combination of their own wedge speaker plus all the other stuff, more is usually the working solution. On big shows, it's quite common for the on stage volume to be enough to fill the auditorium too, which of course just means that the FOH system has to go louder to give control. Many people now want to make sure these awful levels don't cause permanent or temporary hearing loss. Blow the new laws, most performers are very aware of how important their hearing is. Trouble is, it takes a few years to develop your aural skills, and by that time, it could be too late! In ear monitoring effectively seals the ear canal, and then the transducer provides a perfect mix at a non-damaging level. Works rather well. However, it does not sound the same as floor monitors. Often the sound crew mix in a little of a live mic on stage, so the performer can get a little 'reality' - and, of course, hear people cheering, clapping or booing. Some performers cannot quite get used to this, and take one out. This, to me feels wrong. After getting used to in-ears, most people love them. Pros tend to get custom earmoulds made by an audiologist, as these are the most comfy, and seal properly - being the shape of your ear canal. Others were the soft fit ones - you jam 'em in and they gently expand to almost your shape. Ok-ish, depending on your ear shape. I can't wear this kind, I have awkward shapes and quite narrow openings, so they don't stay in. Proper fitted ones are ok, but get rather manky quickly. You can wash them, but it's a bit gross. Most systems are radio, although static musicians like drummers and keyboard players often have permanently wired versions.

[Latchy]

Thanks, How do you set a Monitoring Systems up?

[Killyp]

Depends on how you want it to function, but usually you plug the monitoring system (whether it's a set of amplifiers powering speaker wedges or IEMs) into the sends (in this case, the black knobs half-way up the desk) which allows you to have different mix levels in the monitors, as the sends are (usually) independent of the fader volume.

 

EDIT: as there are 2 sets of sends (there are 4 really, but only 2 can be used as monitor sends), then you can have two separate monitoring mixes.

[tolley1466]

FWIW, they serve the same function as the 'wedge' shaped speakers you often see on the stage pointing at the performers, but the advantage of IEMs is that they don't spill sound into the microphones, so you don't get any feedback.

 

It also is an advantage because the wedges can cause the mix to be muddy.

[Pete McCrea]

FWIW, they serve the same function as the 'wedge' shaped speakers you often see on the stage pointing at the performers, but the advantage of IEMs is that they don't spill sound into the microphones, so you don't get any feedback.

 

It also is an advantage because the wedges can cause the mix to be muddy.

 

That's where the vital bit comes in. Experience. A good experienced Monitor Engineer will be able to get either IEMs or wedges sounding good, and giving the artist what they want without the feed back.

 

The set up also depends on whether the monitoring is run from FOH or a monitor desk. If it's run FOH then chances are it'll be run off the Pre Fade Auxiliary sends. This means that the level going to the monitors isn't affected by the level of the channel fader, giving a constant mix as the FOH mix varies. If it's being run off a Monitor board, then in all chances they'll be running each mix of a Sub Group, where the post fade aux pots will determine the level going to the group- this means that if the guitarist goes for a solo, then you can lift the fader, and this will lift the guitar in the mixes, letting people hear it. It also means you can quickly duck a channel to kill feed back.

 

The technicalities can be learnt pretty quickly. However the practice is where years of experience come in.

[Albatross]

The other reason you see so many people using them nowadays is that they are better for your long term hearing.

snip

 

When used effectively...

If a person using IEM's takes one side out, which happens at times due their feeling isolated from the 'real sound' of the band, the volume into the other ear doesnt appear as loud for them.

As a result they ask for more volume into the remaining IEM to compensate, which is likely to be into damaging volumes.