cliveybaby Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Hi all Would like to hear any tips or tricks anyone has to help with: I have fitted a couple of venues out with a basic dj set up 2 x cdj's, mixer etcthis small dj setup plums straight into the house system that I also fitted but more forthe live pa's and bands. hence the addition. the system is all limited and managed , the problem is no matter how well the system isset up the >rude word< Djs insist on over driving the dj mixer all of the kit works perfectly and nothing is being clipped post the dj mixer I even added some last resort compression between dj and main mixer its just that most of the djs still turn all up to 11 nomatter whatthe signal clips and hence very load but crap sound is their anything out their that can reduce the output from the cd player, pre the dj mixerso even with the dj mixer at +10 on everything the output will not clip im not after "the mixer may still clip" or "s/n levels" or "what kit is it" answersand yes I do know all of the kit inside out and I have not missed any pads or pots Pro advice/new takes would be very useful ThanksClive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkPAman Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Is this any good? Clicky Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliveybaby Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 Topman Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Jeal Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Hi all Would like to hear any tips or tricks anyone has to help with: I have fitted a couple of venues out with a basic dj set up 2 x cdj's, mixer etcthis small dj setup plums straight into the house system that I also fitted but more forthe live pa's and bands. hence the addition. the system is all limited and managed , the problem is no matter how well the system isset up the >rude word< Djs insist on over driving the dj mixer all of the kit works perfectly and nothing is being clipped post the dj mixer I even added some last resort compression between dj and main mixer its just that most of the djs still turn all up to 11 nomatter whatthe signal clips and hence very load but crap sound is their anything out their that can reduce the output from the cd player, pre the dj mixerso even with the dj mixer at +10 on everything the output will not clip im not after "the mixer may still clip" or "s/n levels" or "what kit is it" answersand yes I do know all of the kit inside out and I have not missed any pads or pots Pro advice/new takes would be very useful ThanksClive Clive even if you reduce the input level from the CDJ into the DJ mixer they will still crank the dj mixer gain to hit those red lights they love so much. I've yet to find a way of stopping Djs from doing this. One of the more effective ways of minimising this can be having a booth monitor aimed straight at their heads with a gain offset of maybe 6db driven from the main dj desk output then when they turn it up they tear their own heads off. Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smalljoshua Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Here's a wacky idea. How about a physical stop on the DJ mixer? Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sound In Gloucestershire Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 going old skool here..... a piece of gaffa tape across the fader from 8 upwardsor a small tap screw screwed in at the 7 or 8 mark, the fader wont be going past that(you can even put a notice up saying that removal of tape or screw will result in non-payment for the evening) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Jeal Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Putting a physical stop in still does nothing about the channel gain pots. Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Pearce Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 I've often wondered whether re-calibrating the VU meter to hit max at about -12dB might help this need for red lights that seems to be inherent with most (but not all) DJs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boswell Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Put a pad Inside the CD player on the output terminations, make it big enough so that a 0db test cd will not hit the red lights (or maybe the odd flicker) on the DJ mixer with everthing wound full up on the DJ mixer.Then standback and wait for the complaints that the system is cr*p etc and is not loud enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliveybaby Posted January 5, 2009 Author Share Posted January 5, 2009 quality answers thanks folkswill most likely try all bring back 70's dj's that at least new how to wire a bulgin andchange a belt on a citronic console and gave toss about kit They pay for a decent system, pay to have it set up, pay an engineer forbig events then hand it over to a kid and his cd's who thinks gain is somethingthat happens when you eat too much and red lights are their to make it look 'spooky' and they think its my fault it sounds wrong!!!! If I chop some cable to short I dont abuse my cutters who har cliveybaby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevinE Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 I would say that if they want to make their 'mix' sound distorted, thats up to them, so long as the PA is limited then they'll only hurt their reputation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chubbs the Techie Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 My friend has a solution to this - (I'm not quite sure how he did this, he tried explaining) He does something along the lines of putting wires across the red led that represents clipping on the meter, and connecting them to the headphone amp in the mixer. Means that whenever you clip, your headphones make a god awful noise. Genius. It actually works. However this is on a £150 numark mobile disco mixer....not on your average >£1000 pioneer club install mixer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Chubbs thats actually a cool idea, and one that wouldn't be too hard to implement... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smalljoshua Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Indeed. I'm unsure whether I'd tell the DJ about it, if it were my system, though. Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cedd Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 I was going to suggest a bit of a bodge involving the clip LED, ut it would appear that chubbs has spotted a similar solution. I was going to suggest that the LED drove a transistor and then a relay, which brought in a hefty attenuator on the inputs (back of the mixer hidden away behind a panel - DJ is "presented" with panel mount phono's which go via this attenuator. Big sign next to the clip LED's saying "If I light, volume will be cut" or something else suitably understandable. You'd have to build in some time delay so the thing wasn't constantly pulling in, perhaps 3 seconds? @ Kevin E - I'm afraid that it doesn't quite work like that, at least not as far as I've been told. Once the signal is distorted (clipped/square wave - call it what you want) it will do damage to the system, regardless of how well it is limited further down the chain. You can't "un-clip" a clipped signal (easily). The drivers will still be flying to their full deflection if you attenuate later on. I don't think there's a limiter out there that can sort out a signal that is clipped before it reaches the limiter (would be interested to hear if there is). There's a nice little thread on clipping, in relation to the destruction of a set of drivers, despite the signal being attenuated by a seperate mixer prior to reaching the PA over at Sound on Sound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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