DBX Vs Sabine - Feedback destroyers

[cedd]

Hi all

I've just bought a pair of pcc-160's and I've got a set of hanging mics on the way. I run 8 x headset radio mics (CPC specials on sennheiser SK2012's) and a few float condensers as well.

The bulk of the stuff I do is local school shows, gangshows, churches and a few dance shows.

 

I've always been a believer in buying decent kit to start with but am a bit of a tight yorkshireman when it comes to money! I also don't mind buying older, but decent quality, second hand kit (hence the PCC-160's).

 

So with the introduction over.........

 

I'm looking to buy a feedback destroyer. I know there is nothing like a good sound engineer for sorting out feedback (and I'm nothing like a good sound engineer) but I have used one before (behringer - not mine) and have seen other local engineers use them to great effect.

 

I don't want to turn this into too much of a thread about whether or not they should be used, or how many fixed filters Vs active ones should be used. I'm really after some real life reviews so I can decide which one to go for.

 

I've discounted the Behringer. I'm sure it has its' place, but I really want something a little higher up the ladder.

I now have a choice between the DBX AFS224 which I can get locally with a price match at around £205. It has 24 filters per channel.

 

I also have the choice of the Sabine FBX2400, which is available from Thomann for around £480. It has 12 filters per channel.

 

I've mentioned filter numbers above, and whilst I know they aren't everything and the quality of the filter is also to be considered, is 24 more useful than 12?

I know the Sabine's are supposed to be the best you can get. The question is, how far behind do the DBX's come (£270 worth behind?).

 

As well as getting some reviews, what is the difference between the FBX2400 and the FBX2400plus?

 

Does anybody know of anywhere cheaper for the Sabine units?

Is there some other item I've not considered?

 

Help much appreciated.

[Sound In Gloucestershire]

google says 464 is the cheapest price for the sabine

[Peter F]

google says 464 is the cheapest price for the sabine

 

Ridiculously, you can buy it for LESS US dollars than UKP. $439

 

Sweetwater. Sabine Products

 

The 2400 is a very good unit (and this comes from a monitor engineer so according to union rules I will now me be expelled for ever touching a feedback exterminator!) I was young, I only tried it once, I still had a graphic, it did help make my monitors exceptionally loud.

 

Cheers,

Peter

[cedd]

That's rather interesting, and quite worrying.

 

I have an uncle in the states. Hhhhhmmmm.........

 

Time for a 230v - 115v adapter methinks.

 

Thanks so far. Hope you can see the temptation of the cheaper unit if it lives up to the job and is useful. I just can't find much on whether it actually does the job or not!

[Silvershads]

I would dearly like to hear what folks think of the 2400 Sabine as well. :D

[cedd]

Just to add to this thread (and subtly bump it a little - sorry!).

 

I've now found an fbx2400 in the UK for £449;

 

http://www.rawpower.co.uk/acatalog/Sabine_...terminator.html

 

Never used the supplier before, but shipping is only £7.22 and they say it's usually next day.

 

I'm getting nearer to biting the bullet with this one as I've got a job in a few weeks time that sticks in my mind as being a bit of a feedback nightmare. The local sound control have said they'll match £205 for the DBX, and I really don't know which way to go. My wallet says DBX, my heart says Sabine. Having never worked with either, my brain is as usual saying nothing!

 

I could still attempt to import from the US (and hence get the sabine for only slightly more than the dbx + postage), but would really rather not go there if possible. I've received stuff from the US before, and I suppose it's no different to buying from Thomann in Germany, but it just bothers me.

 

If anybody could end my debate, I'd be very glad to hear it!

[dbuckley]

Can't add anything to the debate as I've never used either product, but am really looking forward to the end of the story...

[Silvershads]

This is a little nudge on this topic. Surely someone must have an opinion on the FBX 2400?

 

I've placed an order for a Behringer DEQ 2496 and, at £200 including VAT, it's good value but not sure exactly how good it would be at quickly killing feedback before locking down. Does anyone have an opinion on this one? I'd love to scrap the purchase and go for the Sabine FBX 2400 but I'm lost as to whether I'd just be paying another £200 for something that's only a teeny bit better (or not at all) than the other two units we're now talking about in here.

 

HELP!

 

Cheers

Chris

[dbuckley]

I have a couple of the little Behringer Sharks, and have tried a Behringer digital graphic EQ with FBX facility, and they work, but in both cases I've been looking for more, if you know what I'm getting at... I was thinking of the Samson D3500 as a possible step up.

 

Edited to add: I dont think there is a person alive who suggests that you can let these boxes work in auto mode, its just far too risky. Certainly I set them up with an empty hall, and nail down the filters...

[Silvershads]

Hi there

 

Many thanks for getting back to me on this one. That's exactly the sort of feedback I need. I was chatting to the guy who has just delivered several power amplifiers to me and his words, when I asked him what he thought of the Behringer unit were "it's OK but the price reflects its place on the ladder, if you know what I mean"... I took that to mean that it wasn't so good and one would need to spend more money if one wants the "real deal".

 

I was concerned also, though, that it looks as though the Sabine has only 12 bands rather than 31/32. Am I correct or does the term "channels" mean something different?

 

Cheers

Chris

[Malcolm Gordon]

I expect you have been looking at this page. The point is that the Sabine can create up to 12 filters in each channel (one for the 1200, two for the 2400), which can be anywhere in the spectrum, i.e. there could be more than one in an octave. Whether 12 is enough depends on your room; usually as each feedback point is notched out others appear but with diminishing strength. Once all 12 filters are set you have reached the limiting maximum gain before feedback, which may or may not be adequate.

[cedd]

The number of filters was something I was seriously looking at. The DBX offering has 24 actual filters, so on paper, double the number on the Sabine. That said, I think in this case it's quality, not quantity. The Sabine can see the difference between harmonic-rich guitar suspended notes and feedback, in a way which I don't think the DBX can.

 

Pay day on tuesday! Then there may well be a Sabine joining my stock. I'd love it if all the gear was behringer prices and did the job, indeed my behringer loudspeaker manageent does exactly that, but in this case I think I've got to go with the higher end piece of kit.

 

I don't think the DBX one is in particularly wide use. It certainly seems to have the least nuber of reviews, both here and in general online. Perhaps it's just in that difficult place on the market - if you want a cheap one, buy behringer. If you want something better, you'll look straight to the Sabine unit.

 

Peavey and Shure also have their own units, the Shure being a lot more money than anything else. That said, the Sabine still seems to have the professional end of the market.

[Silvershads]

That's it! With comments from in here and after just reading the spec sheet AND the entire operations manual - I have to have one of these babies! I'm placing the order tomorrow. The Sabine sounds like the pups pieces. So... we'll use the FBX 2400 for the Main speaker system and I have a nice dual 31 band Behringer (are we allowed to have the word "nice" and "Behringer" in the same sentence? <ducking>) in the monitor loop. Fingers crossed!

 

I'll leave some feedback <groan> in here when we use it for the first time.

 

Cheers

Chris

[cedd]

Well, to round off the thread a little. I've just bought an FBX2400. Got a good price on a new unit and decided to bite the bullet.

 

There is an interesting reply to some comments made by DBX on the Sabine website (opens a pdf document);

 

http://www.sabine.com/resources/FBX/Litera...dbx-030319a.pdf

 

I'll leave you to see what you think. Personally I'm happy with the good words said by blue roomers and others I know about the Sabine units. Part of me wants to buy the dbx unit just to do a comparison and properly round this thread off, but I'm not made of money!

 

Thanks to all who've contributed.

[Silvershads]

Hi there, Cedd

 

We haven't actually use the two Sabines we've now bought - no time yet, but we're so excited about the product and what it promises to do better than the others out there, that we're firmly convinced we're going to be ecstatic with them when we finally switch them on.

 

In fact, so impressed are we on paper, from reviews, from what's been said in here, etc., we have decided to become that involved that we have applied to become a Sabine reseller. Not sure whether we're supposed to be announcing that here so hope not to have fingers slapped for it, but for those who want good prices on the FBX 2400 unit, why not have a look at eBay and search for the product there?

 

I'm really looking forward to our own experiences with the units and I will, for sure, leave some feedback (no pun etc...) in here once we've done that.

 

All the best

Chris