Cueing sounds - comments sought

[palantir]

Greetings

 

First off - I'm an enthusiastic amateur:

 

The show, Wiz of Oz panto, starts february 10th & I'd appreciate comments on my method of firing sound cues while there's time for changes.

 

Although I use a computer to download, edit & multitrack sounds, I'm loathe to commit to running the entire shebang from the laptop; therefor my setup is :-

 

CD player runs all music tracks for dance etc.

Minidisk has all ambient/background sounds

Multiplay (on the laptop) for Listed cues (Entry of witch etc.)

Soundplant " for the rapid-reaction sounds (thunder, squeaky wheels, farts etc.......)

 

I've run pretty much this way for a few years now & it works well for me .... However, changing rapidly from Soundplant to Multiplay for quick-following cues, it's very easy to forget to click on the Multiplay window, resulting in Soundplant staying live & firing-off a sound as I hit the keyboard:

Can be embarassing :) .

 

Can anyone suggest how to make this setup idiot-proof? Or is there a better ( cheap ) approach ?

 

Thanks

 

Pete

[charlier]

Can anyone suggest how to make this setup idiot-proof? Or is there a better ( cheap ) approach ?

Easy - use our free version of SoundMan-Designer for all playbacks and show control - you can script it all and create a large number of hot buttons to trigger all the spot effects as well.

 

http://www.richmondsounddesign.com/index.html

[ceecrb1]

as a bare minimum powerpoint can make a crude audio cue list......

[dbuckley]

Any of the decent audio playback tools will do everything you want in one program. A cue list with scripted sounds, and keys for instant reaction. Playing back an ambient whilst firing off cues is bread and butter. I think theres even a section in the Wiki about sound playback stuff.

 

I use PCStage which is harder to use in some ways than some of the more popular tools, but has more depth than some other options.

 

I don't do embaressing in shows, so things going wrong due to having too much or the wrong technology is not acceptable to me. I use one tool that does it all and does it right. For example, having door knocker (or fart) buttons, cool trick, but not at the wrong time. Therefore I use features that only enable the appropriate hot buttons at appropriate times. I generally only use one hot button, and it produces the right effect at the right time. Planning and preparation prevents p*ss poor performance.

[unclesteve]

Hi Pete,

I use one piece of software for all my cues on a laptop. It's called Q Wizard. Have a look here :

http://www.qwizard.com It's very easy to set up and use. It's never let me down so far.

I've used it for plays, pantos, professional wrestling shows. You can download a demo version so

you can try before you buy !

 

Steve

[Swizzuk]

I realise you said you were unsure of running a whole show of a laptop.

But...

If your not looking for multiple outputs, the very basic licence of soundcuesystem is excellent.

I use the pro version as I use up to 8 outputs to channel sound to different parts of the stage and hall.

I totally love it. Would like to use SFX but just can't justify the cost of it for me.

Soundcuesystem is really worth it, so simple to use.

[Bobbsy]

Frankly, for panto (at least the last few years I did one) I just did everything on Soundplant. If your version is anything like the one I worked on for many years, there's as much ad libbing as there is script and I was positively encouraged to join in the process. Soundplant was perfect for this.

 

Soundplant works happily on a VERY low spec PC so I simply bought a second hand machine, put in a new (cheap) hard drive and an old sound card I had around, installed Windows, Soundplant and my early version of Cool Edit 2000 (for editing cues), giving me a super clean machine for sound. The total expenditure was under £200 and it's lasted at least five years without a single hiccup.

 

Just as a backup, (and to allow me to use the computer to edit new cues or whatever at the last minute) I'd hook up a CD player as well. I'd use this for walk in and interval music...and have a disk with all the important sound effects included. Obviously, this wouldn't give me all the flexibility Soundplant did, but ensured that the dancers got their music, and any effects essential to moving on the plot could be played. However, I've never had to resort to using this backup.

 

Just for the record, it's only panto I do this way...for more predictable shows, I'd go with something like SFX or SCS. However, (touch wood big time) while I've had both CD and MD players die on me mid show, to date I've never lost a cue due to a computer problem. There. I've done it. Tempted fate big time!

 

Bob

[palantir]

If your version is anything like the one I worked on for many years, there's as much ad libbing as there is script and I was positively encouraged to join in the process. Soundplant was perfect for this.

 

Oh yes there is....adlibbing that is.......

 

and have a disk with all the important sound effects included. Obviously, this wouldn't give me all the flexibility Soundplant did, but ensured that the dancers got their music,

 

Same here, the laptop cues backed-up to minidisk & minidisk backed-up to CD, in hope I never have to use them.

 

(touch wood big time) while I've had both CD and MD players die on me mid show, to date I've never lost a cue due to a computer problem. There. I've done it. Tempted fate big time!

 

Funny that, I recently read a lighting thread where the poster had seen many a computer driven system crash, but never had a dedicated desk fail <_< Thanks for the input - much appreciatedPeteThanks for all the replies - I'll have to look more closely at Multiplay, as there does seem to be a hotkey option & I think I may have misunderstood how it works: I get confused easily ;) .

 

Pete

[Bobbsy]

I think the trick is to have as stable and clean an installation as possible. The more extra rubbish that starts up when you boot the system, the more chance there is of things going wrong. However, I have to say that even when using my "general use" laptop (as opposed to the special setup I described) so far I've not had any problems using PC for playback. Except for long-form music off CD, I haven't used anything other than computer for playback for the last 5 or 6 years...and haven't had any crashes or freezes to date. In the 5 or 6 years before that, I had more CD stutters, MD jams, etc. than I can remember accurately.

 

I'm sold on computer playback whatever the lighting guys might say. (As an aside, I think computer driven lighting systems are aimed at the low-end market; most professional systems use dedicated consoles. However, there are a lot of fully professional sound playback systems for computers. I'll sit back and wait for the scream at THAT statement!)

 

Bob

[Shez]

I haven't used anything other than computer for playback for the last 5 or 6 years...and haven't had any crashes or freezes to date. In the 5 or 6 years before that, I had more CD stutters, MD jams, etc. than I can remember accurately.

 

Before computer playback systems became prevalent, were problems with CD/MD playback really that common? I still use them as the majority of shows I do don't tend call for overlapping or really quickfire cues so I've not seen the need to introduce more complex technology. I can't currently recall any instances of problems with those playback methods. Maybe I've just been lucky ;)

For the one show I toured that needed very rapid fire cues, (a few years back now) I used an Akai sampler and two octave keyboard to trigger. Took a while to set it all up but worked perfectly every night.

Having said all that, when a show comes along that has more complex requirements, I'll look forward to having a play with a computer based system. <_<

[palantir]

Panto, particularly the level of amateur production that I have experience of, is far from being complex - It's just totally unpredictable: When the Dame goes off down the other trouser leg, the poor old soundie has to decide PDQ whether to go along for the ride, or wait a few lines to see if the sonofabitch realizes and switches back into the same scene as everyone else!

 

Pete

[charlier]

One point that I should have made is that with an integrated show control program, you can also trigger perfectly synchronised lighting and special effects cues and macros at the same time as the audio stingers....

[dbuckley]

Absolutely.

 

I believe the old paradigm of "the sound op" and "the light op" is fundementally flawed as we enter the 21st century. I believe shows work much better when you have "the guy in front of the computer with the cans on" who is responsible for lighting and sound / fx playback and any other electronically controlable show elements" and "the guy operating the mixer".

 

Mixing and running a playback tool (any playback tool) is a bad compromise because mixing demands cans off whereas running cues demands cans on. So generally the sound guy runs autonomously with cans off, as you can't really mix with the cans on, and thus is out of instant reach of stage management.

 

Bob also makes a salient point about reliability - LX guys are frightened of computer systems as they apparently crash all the time, yet sound has over a decade of real experience using computer playback, and although at the higher levels dual systems with switchover is preferable, single systems well looked after do work night after night...

[Joe]

I use Sound Cue System (www.soundcuesystem.com) and have found that to be a very good and easy to use system. It will work quite happily of the inbuilt sound card on a PC, or you can use an external card and the have multi speaker, multi route system for more sophisticated setups. It has hot key capability so sounds can be called at the press of a nominated key, playlists for interval music, then all the capabilities to pick start and stop points and loops as well as sub cues.

 

If I do need to record someting special I have Audacity on the laptop. Both these systems have done me proud through quite a number of productions, ranging from Macbeth to Panto.

[TallMike]

a good bit of free software is PodProducer!

 

plays back stings via buttons, and tracks via carts.