Neil Hampson Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 This year in panto, our main flown finale piece is a 'frenchman flat', I've never come across the term before and the consensus around the crew is that 'Y' called it a frenchman so I called it one... so my question is quite simple, when does a flown flat become a 'frenchman'?, and for a bonus point, Why?The one in question is four sections bolted together to make a 20' by 25' flat with a large hole in the middle, for the cast to come through on the walkdown. A search came up with thousands of things French, but nothing to do with the stage. Thanks in advance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grahame Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 From Theatrecrafts Glossary:FRENCH FLATA scenic flat which is flown into position, usually with French braces. Consists of a number of flats fixed together with battens. Also known as a Frenchman.and before you ask...FRENCH BRACE Right-angled non adjustable triangular frame, made from timber, and attached to the flat with pin hinges. Often swung flush to the flat for storage or flying. So there we are then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neil Hampson Posted January 10, 2008 Author Share Posted January 10, 2008 OK, Thanks for that.(although the one we have doesn't have any bracing, which may have given me a clue as to the name) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImagineerTom Posted January 10, 2008 Share Posted January 10, 2008 generally speaking (in my experiance) in modern theatre design/touring it's called a flat if it's a solid piece and a frenchman if it's got holes / openings / windows / doors in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grahame Posted January 11, 2008 Share Posted January 11, 2008 generally speaking (in my experiance) in modern theatre design/touring it's called a flat if it's a solid piece and a frenchman if it's got holes / openings / windows / doors in it.That's interesting - I've never heard that distinction before. AFAIK any flying piece comprising a number of flats battened together is a French flat or Frenchman. I guess the question is whether each individual flat could be stood on its own using a French brace instead of being flown? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obsoperator Posted January 12, 2008 Share Posted January 12, 2008 Which raises the question, on this side of the pond, why is painting vertically on a paint frame "American" scenic painting, and painting flat on the floor "Continental" scene painting? Surely the "French" term must have something to do with the centuries-old rivalry between France and England - as expressed, for example, in this chorus from Ruddigore . But I can't figure out how it's "insulting" to call a flown unit, or a flat with openings, "French". I call a wood-framed jack, whether or not it has a diagonal brace, an "L-Jack". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tij5987 Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 There are many phrases/names/items etc in theatre that relate to sailing..... many theatres would employ sailors who were out of work (im no historian so not going to give examples of dates etc) due to their handy knowledge of knots etc.... Hence many thearical terms were born... we RIG lanterns and set, we store scenery in the scene DOCK, the stage floor is known as the DECK.... a FRENCHMAN is another such example - British sailors would execute captured French soldiers/sailors by hanging them from the masts of their ships, hence any peice of solid flown flat scenery is known as a FRENCHMAN.... compared to a piece of similar properties that is pushed on from the wing areas (sliders etc) which are known as ENGLISHMEN.... I must say now that I am 100% a lampy and not a stage boy what-so-ever, however, I too was curious of the whereabouts of this term and so approached the stage manager at my venue a few yrs ago (who is a very reliable and knowledable chap!) and that was his repsonse! Hope that is of some help :s Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidLee Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 There are many phrases/names/items etc in theatre that relate to sailing..... many theatres would employ sailors who were out of work (im no historian so not going to give examples of dates etc) due to their handy knowledge of knots etc.... Hence many thearical terms were born... we RIG lanterns and set, we store scenery in the scene DOCK, the stage floor is known as the DECK.... a FRENCHMAN is another such example - British sailors would execute captured French soldiers/sailors by hanging them from the masts of their ships, hence any peice of solid flown flat scenery is known as a FRENCHMAN.... compared to a piece of similar properties that is pushed on from the wing areas (sliders etc) which are known as ENGLISHMEN.... I must say now that I am 100% a lampy and not a stage boy what-so-ever, however, I too was curious of the whereabouts of this term and so approached the stage manager at my venue a few yrs ago (who is a very reliable and knowledable chap!) and that was his repsonse! Hope that is of some help :s Tom ... and thus is born an Urban Myth! David Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tij5987 Posted January 13, 2008 Share Posted January 13, 2008 Ahhhh, so maybe I was misinformed!!!! Told u I'm a lampy!!!! Just sharing what I had heard. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitlane Posted January 15, 2008 Share Posted January 15, 2008 A good reason for putting braces on a flown flat is if it has a functioning door. As the door is opened, the flat will tilt unless it is braced to the floor. So maybe a Frenchman was originally a flown flat with a functioning door which consequently needs French braces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grahame Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 So maybe a Frenchman was originally a flown flat with a functioning door which consequently needs French braces. I like the cut of your jib, sir! Oh sorry, we were moving away from the nautical connection weren't we? :** laughs out loud **: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Basson Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 Dictionary.com offers the following definition: a flat that can be raised to or hung from the flies, and that contains practicable doors, windows, etc. While suggesting the word first appeared in the 1870s and is an Americanism, which is interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoLiEn Posted January 29, 2008 Share Posted January 29, 2008 .... I prefer the sailing terminology! it made me laugh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cockle Posted February 4, 2008 Share Posted February 4, 2008 When I first started playing with things theatrical I asked the same question of a wise old hand at the flying game and the explanation seemed quite plausible, although I've never seen it written down anywhere.His explanation was that the English theatre tradition was, originally, to have flats mounted vertically on runners which were then pushed on and off stage as required, obviously this requires a good amount of wing space to allow storage of the 'dead' flats. This was fine in England as theatres tended to be built wide but shallow.However, French theatre was highly regulated by the state and there were very few purpose built licenced theatres until the mid-late 1600's when theatre was liberalised and dis-used tennis courts were converted into theatres. The problem then arose that the converted tennis courts were only about 30' wide and therefore there was very limited width in the wings, fortunately most of the buldings had high roofs and therefore the scenery was predominantly cloths, as they were lighter than flats, suspended from above on a pulley system and flown in or out as required, the early flys. The only problem was that this precluded any entrances or exits up/down stage through the scenery line, the solution became a flat or flats with the door or window being flown to provide the entrance. As they were almost the preserve of the French theatre they became known as 'French Flats' or 'a Frenchman'.How true this is I can't say, as it is, like most theatre terms, shrouded in mystery from a murky past but it had a ring of logic to it and no-one has ever proved it wrong so it's as good an explanation as any!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emj Posted February 5, 2008 Share Posted February 5, 2008 All previous answers are very good The 1 I have all ways been given and anybody else from the fly floor always agrees with is that they are called Frenchmen Because the are B#~=#*ds Pardon my french but it is a technical term RegardsEm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.