lexicon pcm81/91??

[thewhirlwind]

hi

I've got this craving to buy some new gear and I thought I might get either a lexicon pcm81 or 91.

the unit will be used purely on a female vocal . I am on a quest searching for the perfect sound! :-)

the singer is particularly good at the big ballads(whitney houston etc) so I want to try and get a real pro

vocal sound.she is a solo singer and we use backing tracks.

 

current gear we take out to gigs is:-

pair of eaw jfx290 speakers (run bi amp)

crown xti4000 for the lows

crown xti2000 for the highs

dynacord cms1000 mixer (I use the reverbs on this at the moment but don't know how good they are?)

spl channel one pre amp compressor eq that I insert into the vocal channel

tc electronic m one xl

sennheiser e365 radio mic or neumann kms 105

and a partridge in a pair tree!

 

 

does anyone have any knowledge of the lexicons? if so any thoughts on if one of them would really

improve our vocal sound or am I wasting my money?digital village have the pcm81 @ £799 and the pcm91 @ £999 or I could probably get either one shipped over from the states for approx £750.

any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

happy christmas to everyone.

[Rob_Beech]

Hi,

 

To start with are you therefore not using the preamp section on the ....preamp? as you mention inserting it, which I assume means on a channel insert which will be after the desks pre-amp.

 

As for the effects. Built in fx on desks are generally there as a handy feature to keep the system compact and "all in one". Whilst some are poor, some are actually more than useable for most work (I have no first hand experience of that particular boards fx).

 

If you currently use the boards inbuilt fx what do you use the M one for?

 

As for what to buy. My advice is try them. if you are going to be spending well on the way to £1000 on a piece of outboard I would certainly try one first. See if a local hire company has them in stock and hire one for a gig or 2 to see how the perform.

[thewhirlwind]

Hi,To start with are you therefore not using the preamp section on the ....preamp? as you mention inserting it, which I assume means on a channel insert which will be after the desks pre-amp.As for the effects. Built in fx on desks are generally there as a handy feature to keep the system compact and "all in one". Whilst some are poor, some are actually more than useable for most work (I have no first hand experience of that particular boards fx).If you currently use the boards inbuilt fx what do you use the M one for?As for what to buy. My advice is try them. if you are going to be spending well on the way to £1000 on a piece of outboard I would certainly try one first. See if a local hire company has them in stock and hire one for a gig or 2 to see how the perform.

thanks for your reply robsorry, the main reason I use the spl channel one is for its compressor,maybe I don't need it at all as most solo singers I know don't use one, but I just feel it smooths out the big high loud notes a bit.it does have a good quality pre amp and eq on it aswell so should I run the mic into this first and then into the mixer?? or is there no point so I should just carry on with it as an insert as I am.I'm not the most knowledgeable with this stuff but I try to buy good quality gear and hope that I'm using it right so any advice from people like yourself is much appreciated. thanks

Hi,To start with are you therefore not using the preamp section on the ....preamp? as you mention inserting it, which I assume means on a channel insert which will be after the desks pre-amp.As for the effects. Built in fx on desks are generally there as a handy feature to keep the system compact and "all in one". Whilst some are poor, some are actually more than useable for most work (I have no first hand experience of that particular boards fx).If you currently use the boards inbuilt fx what do you use the M one for?As for what to buy. My advice is try them. if you are going to be spending well on the way to £1000 on a piece of outboard I would certainly try one first. See if a local hire company has them in stock and hire one for a gig or 2 to see how the perform.

oh forgot to add I currently use 2 reverbs on the mixer and an effect on the m one xl that I think from memory is called female big ballad (it has eq on it that seems to me to make the vocal stand out in the mix a bit more).I don't really know if what I use is technically right as I just try and go by what I think sounds good.I try and get as natural a vocal sound as possible as I don't like too much chorus/vocoder etc effects.I read a while back that george michael used a tc reverb 6000 on his tour as he always seems to get an excellent vocal sound imo but it didn't tell you how they used it or what they used with it.

[Bobbsy]

I'll chime in with Rob here. In the TC M-one XL you have a pretty good effects unit. Like Rob, I don't know the Dynacord effects but I use the M-one quite often and like it a lot. Although Lexicon make excellent effects units, I'm not personally convinced that the difference you'll hear between that and the TC unit will be enough to justify the extra money. I'd certainly have a play with the M-one before spending a thousand quid more...and, like Rob, at that sort of cost, I'd want to listen to any new unit I was considering.

 

One thing to consider about ANY reverb: I always find that the ratio of "dry" to "wet" is almost as important as the choice of reverb settings. Very minor tweaks to the level of the effects return can have major implications for the sound. For this reason, unless I'm desperately short of capacity on the mixer, I prefer to use my 'verbs on a post fade Aux send with a return to a spare channel. I find this gives me more control...and has the added advantage of making the effects unit usable by more than one channel.

 

Bob

[thewhirlwind]

I'll chime in with Rob here. In the TC M-one XL you have a pretty good effects unit. Like Rob, I don't know the Dynacord effects but I use the M-one quite often and like it a lot. Although Lexicon make excellent effects units, I'm not personally convinced that the difference you'll hear between that and the TC unit will be enough to justify the extra money. I'd certainly have a play with the M-one before spending a thousand quid more...and, like Rob, at that sort of cost, I'd want to listen to any new unit I was considering.

 

One thing to consider about ANY reverb: I always find that the ratio of "dry" to "wet" is almost as important as the choice of reverb settings. Very minor tweaks to the level of the effects return can have major implications for the sound. For this reason, unless I'm desperately short of capacity on the mixer, I prefer to use my 'verbs on a post fade Aux send with a return to a spare channel. I find this gives me more control...and has the added advantage of making the effects unit usable by more than one channel.

 

Bob

thanks for your reply bob,

I do use the m one xl on aux send and return it to a stereo channel so I hopefully I'm doing this right.

one of my reasons for posting was that from what I've read, the lexicon pcm91 is an industry standard reverb unit so maybe alot of people on here may have experience of using it and people say that it has a dark sound to it.I find the sound I'm getting at the moment a little bit ringy in the tails and I wondered if it was because I'm using a relatively cheap reverb unit.I'll try and experiment with the wet/dry mix like you suggest and see how I go.

[Ben Langfeld]

If the M-one isn't giving you the right effect, you don't need to change the unit, just change the effect. Manufacturer presets aren't the be-all and end-all. You say you're using it just for EQ? Why not just use the desk's EQ then? What exactly is the effect that you want to achieve?

[thewhirlwind]

If the M-one isn't giving you the right effect, you don't need to change the unit, just change the effect. Manufacturer presets aren't the be-all and end-all. You say you're using it just for EQ? Why not just use the desk's EQ then? What exactly is the effect that you want to achieve?

thanks for your reply

I'm not using it just for eq.....I'm using an effect that from memory is called female big ballad and is made up from I think reverb and eq.its just a sound I liked from running through the presets but you've made a good point maybe I should try and tweek the presets a bit.

I'm just looking for a warm lush sound and I was guessing that I would need a fairly expensive reverb unit to get it.there must be something in these expensive units otherwise studios etc wouldn't spend grands on having the top of the range ones.

[Ben Langfeld]

there must be something in these expensive units otherwise studios etc wouldn't spend grands on having the top of the range ones.

 

That's quite true, but the law of diminishing returns applies in pro audio. Also, an M-one is a very good quality unit and should see you through to quite large shows/budgets.