connecting In-ear montiors to monitor channel

[neil7831]

Hello,

 

I have recently purchased a second hand set of sennheiser IEM 300 G2 in ear monitoring system.

Having found the system to be fantastic, and a great joy to use, I seem to have come across a difficulty.

When I connect the wireless transmitter to the sound desk ( to get a mix) I run it out of either monitor output 1 or monitor output 2 , I hear nothing through my in ears?

the frequesncies are the same on my transmitter and reciever, I can hear a mix perfectly through the solo headphone socket on the desk, but absolutley nothing from the monitor out puts?

can anyone shed some light on the matter?

I know the system works perfectly as through the headphone output I hear everything, but through the monitor channels nothing?

and I also tried to run a line out from one of the stage wedges to my system and again nothing? the only way I can get any sound through it is plugging it into the headphone socket on the desk?

 

any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

if it helps the desk we are using is a bit rubbish but its the fender pX 22120 mixing desk , it has phantom power and it has built in effects, should it make a difference.

 

Thanks,

 

Regards,

 

Neil

[Bobbsy]

What happens if you plug something else (amp and speaker for example) into the monitor outputs? Have you checked that the cable you're using is wired correctly and working properly?

 

Bob

[Rob_Beech]

This could be the old stereo/mono balanced/unbalanced gremlin that often crops up with this type of thing.

 

I'll second everything Bob says here. try something else in the monitor output. Make sure the lead is wired for the output of the desk.

 

I'll risk having a bit of a guess as to what could be the problem. although without more information I cannot be sure.

 

You may have unbalanced monitor outs, using a balanced lead. When plugging in you are picking up the tip and sleeve but the ring has no contact.

When plugging into the headphones socket you will pick up the T R and S from the socket giving you a signal.

It does however bring us to the question, surely the left and right outputs from the headphones socket would be of the opposite polarity on the input to the TX.

 

So really, we need to know whether the outputs on the desk (the monitor ones) are balanced or unbalanced, and how the connecting cable is wired pin to pin.

But first of all, check another monitor on the output to make sure the output is actually working.

hope its almost made a little sense, its getting late and I'm up early tomorrow.

[Bobbsy]

I was having the same thought as Rob but tried Googling your desk for some tech info...and came up blank.

 

However, if the monitor outs ARE unbalanced, as Rob says you have to be careful with the wiring of your leads or you could well get nothing. Note that if the outs ARE unbalanced, the Sennheiser XLRs can also take unbalanced with clever wiring...as specified in the manual.

 

As Rob says: step one, check the desk outs for balanced/unbalanced, step two check that there's actually a signal there and (if step two says yes) step three is check the wiring in your cables is appropriate for step one.

 

Bob

[mackerr]

When I connect the wireless transmitter to the sound desk ( to get a mix) I run it out of either monitor output 1 or monitor output 2 , I hear nothing through my in ears?

the frequesncies are the same on my transmitter and reciever, I can hear a mix perfectly through the solo headphone socket on the desk, but absolutley nothing from the monitor out puts?

can anyone shed some light on the matter?

I know the system works perfectly as through the headphone output I hear everything, but through the monitor channels nothing?

and I also tried to run a line out from one of the stage wedges to my system and again nothing? the only way I can get any sound through it is plugging it into the headphone socket on the desk?

As others have said, are you sure there is output from the monitor out? Do you have the monitor send controls up on all the channels you want in the mix, and the monitor master up? Are they prefader? If they are post, the channel faders need to be up as well. Have you tried listening to the monitor out directly into headphones? This is a real easy way to see if there is signal there. If it is a balanced out you should hear sound in both ears, unbalanced will only be one ear.

 

Exactly how are you hooking up the IEM system to the headphone output of the desk? How are you hooking up to the monitor out of the desk? More information will get you a more informed solution.

 

Mac

[maeterlinck]

Monitor may refer to control room monitoring, and therefore would only work if you a PFL/AFL on.

If you have Auxes try one of those.

As said note the whether things are post or pre fader and the master and input levels to the bus.

[neil7831]

Hi there, everyone, thanks for your comments.

I can't get any sound out of the aux outputs either? and the monitor outs work perfectly on the stage wedges, so the outputs are fine as far as I'm aware. I tried googling the desk also and nothing came up. I did suggest to someone about it and they thought it may be because of the effects build in to the desk? is that possible? I dont know but it is really frustrating only being able to use it on the solo channel of the desk!!! I can't adjust volumes in my mix or anything!

however, I am going to try and spend some time with thte desk and the monitors today to try and resolve this issue, if I get anywhere I will post a reply as im sure we'd all like to know! but thanks for you help, if any of you manage to find an answer to this never ending saga please do let me know!

 

Thank you

 

Neil.

 

oh and by the way, this is how I am hooking up my iem's.

 

I am running a stereo jack ouput from monitor 1 ouput on desk which then splits in to left mono and right stereo inputs on my iem transmitter. I can't see how that would be a problem but I certainly am not a sound tech guru, so I may be wrong.

 

regards

 

NEil

[Bobbsy]

Almost certainly a cabling mismatch then, but without the details of how the monitor outs on your desk are configured, it's hard to be completely specific.

 

However, don't be mislead that in professional audio that a jack with three connectors (known as a TRS for "tip/ring/sleeve") is "stereo". Except for headphone outs, it rarely is. More likely this would be a balanced output and, as such, the sort of split you're talking about would be precisely your problem. Add to this the fact that the XLRs on the IEM can be either balanced or unbalanced depending on the wiring of your connection and you have a recipe for trouble.

 

I'd try (in order): a TRS to XLR wired conventionally and going to a single input, and if that doesn't work, a TS jack to an XLR wired in accordance with the Sennheiser manual for unbalanced working.

 

Bob

[Matt Riley]

EDIT: Bobbsy beat me, d'oh!

 

Hi Neil, I think I've found the manual for your desk (or similar) - the px2200 seriesclicky - Warning - 20mb file!

 

The problem lies in the fact that your desk has mono, balanced jacks on the aux outputs, and you have a stereo, unbalanced TRS to 2 XLR lead - assuming you are using the G2 IEMs. It works with the headphone output, as this is designed for a stereo unbalanced TRS jack to plug into it.

 

To make it work you need to wire up a balanced (TRS) jack to XLR lead for the auxillary send which you are using for the in ear monitor mix. They look like this - Tip of jack to pin 2 of XLR (+ve), ring of jack to pin 3 XLR(-ve), sleeve of jack to pin 1 XLR (screen). Connect this in between your aux send and the 'left/mono' channel of your in ears. Voila! Now you should have a mono set of in ears fed off of the aux.

 

BTW, If it was going to be a 'mixwiz-esque' problem with the built in effects (which I don't recon it is) it would occur with both in ears and conventional monitors.

 

HTH,

 

Matt

[neil7831]

ah ha!! we have liftoff!!

 

I pluged the stereo jack through an adapter to make it mono!!

it works!!! woohoo!

 

thank you all very much,

 

this was my first forum topic I've ever started to get help and I must admit I'm really touched by all the help and effort people have put in to help me.

 

thank you so so much.

 

I'll certainly post here again.

 

thank you

 

Neil.

[Ben Langfeld]

But it's not stereo, that's what people are saying. It's balanced. What you've likely done is unbalanced it at the desk by accident with your "adapter".

[neil7831]

hmm. now I'm confused!

 

before I added the adapter I was using a stereo to 2x mono jack splitter intomy transmitter ( this is the cable that came with my IEM's)

after hearing the information I plugged in a mono jack on the end of my sereo jack and thus created some form of connection which worked.

so according to what you are saying, I need to some how make the stereo jack work without the adapter?

 

thanks for your help

 

Neil

[Ben Langfeld]

It's not a stereo jack. That's the whole point. It's a TRS jack. And the "mono" jacks are TS jacks. Have a read of this page on the wiki to get your head around it. Basically, you're using completely the wrong cable. If you want a stereo mix, you have to take two TRS-TRS jack leads from auxes to L & R inputs on the transmitter. If you only want a mono mix, you want a TRS-TRS jack lead from one aux to L/M on the transmitter.

[Rob_Beech]

It seems you have a lead that converts to something then to something else, back to something else and then back to where you started.

 

this is a recipe for disaster. there is no specialist wiring required for this setup which is a bonus as you don't have to remember how things are wired. You don't even have to make a cable up yourself these are off the shelf items.

 

 

Just to confirm you need a balanced jack (same idea as a stereo jack, infact the same jack but called balanced) to XLR (male) lead. wired up as normal (mentioned by Matt).

 

Monitor out via this lead to left/mono input on your IEM unit.

 

and re your thank you.... thats what we're here for :D

 

 

Rob

[paulears]

to make this even more straight forward, the lead you had will plug into the stereo output from a headphone type socket, or your pc audio output. Most desks that have outputs on jack sockets will be either balanced, or unbalanced MONO. Depending on how the socket is wired using this cable the most likely scenario will be that one of the inputs will be shorted to earth, or left floating. At best, you'd get one input that worked. The snag could be that you had the system set up for mono operation, and the working input went to the channel that was unused?

 

unbalancing a balanced output is pretty common, but the snag, as mentioned is that to do it, one leg gets shorted to ground. the problem is that some people ground different legs. So if you use my unbalancer, using somebody elses on the other end if you need to go back to a balanced input is no signal and a total short!