Jump to content

Worst show I’ve ever worked on, what should I do?


Recommended Posts

Sometimes you may not get paid! That's not how you planned it but that's how it happens sometimes. In the OPs example you are hoping that the producer/ director has received enough from the box office or has enough private funds, which after a time at uni....?

Sadly "Who holds employer liability insurance?" and "Who is going to pay me(my invoice)?" and "Who holds the bar and event licences/notices?" are very negative questions at interview but need to be asked and answered before working with or for any show.

Put all the h's in Dahling and all the oo's in woosh as you exit.

Two more shows and you will be able to drop this from a CV a/gaps are normal in theatre, b/it's the first, no-one knows when you started.

Maintain a list of people you would like to work again with and consider keeping in touch, and the opposite.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

47 minutes ago, Jivemaster said:

Sometimes you may not get paid! That's not how you planned it but that's how it happens sometimes. 

 

I am still owed £20 from 1972 but the lesson paid for itself many times over the years. On the other point I was called in for a MIlenium Ball event where the organiser was struggling and it was only at a meeting the day before in answer to a question about the licence all I got was in reply 'What Licence?' 

Edited by Junior8
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

After reading everyone’s responses, and reflecting on this horrible experience, I’ve realised how naive I was three weeks ago but how much stronger I am now. I’ve experienced the worst of the worst, where everything that can go wrong went wrong, and thank god it’s just a small panto with incredibly small audiences with a Director no one knows. We don’t have programs either, unless they arrive by surprise on the las day, so at least no one knows our names or faces or will remember them.

The more I look back the more stupid I look to myself. From my understanding this Director/Producer has got all this money from their wealthy family, who appear to have invested quite a bit in this ‘theatre company’ of hers. She doesn’t have a day job, and doesn’t seem to have ever had one. Now the show has actually started I realise this is just a big ego trip, which is why I’m worried now about being paid. This person hasn’t reacted well to bad responses, has awful people skills when talking to audience members (I’m genuinely worried she might snap at someone over the few days if this continues), and their backstage etiquette is terrible. They don’t read rehearsal reports, and they keep insisting it’s a good show.

Some edits to the script were made today, which vastly improve things in my opinion, but I don’t think it will fix the awful backlash. Actors are also confused, and the director/producer always has their phone off so it’s impossible to contact them with questions. Even if I don’t get paid, I’ll just be happy to go home on Sunday and never return. 
 

After the show is over and I’ve received my payment, hopefully, should I sit this person down and tell them how much they ######ed up or should I just never talk to them again? I know they have plans for a panto next year too, and I couldn’t bear to put anyone else through something as bad as this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Junior8 said:

I am still owed £20 from 1972 but the lesson paid for itself many times over the years. On the other point I was called in for a MIlenium Ball event where the organiser was struggling and it was only at a meeting the day before in answer to a question about the licence all I got was in reply 'What Licence?' 

Written here before about a major city that had 60+young people driving minibuses full of children none of whom had a D1 driving licence but had been "tested" by a council driver. The police were not amused and the council insurance woman near fainted. Same council I found an annual festival that neighbourhood officers not only held licensable events but a bar because; "The park is council owned and we always do it this way."

Me, I just love the online small claims system. 

E2A Just walk away politely, they may also have learned a big lesson and if they contact you again that will instantly be clear. 

Edited by kerry davies
Addition
Link to comment
Share on other sites

There's rarely anything to be gained by shouting the odds.  All you'll end up with is a reputation for being an awkward so and so.   If it was rubbish and you are able to say you've done your best, then walk away and learn from the experience. 

I worked in a school.  In teacher mode, it was important to me that the students learned from their mistakes and thus became experienced.  In technician mode, if an outside body came in and were disorganised* then I did what I could to make it work, waved them goodbye and forgot all about it.  Not my problem.   

We've all been part of things we were unhappy with but it's just another gig.

*Disorganised is very kind to some of the visiting speakers/groups.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

First rule - do not talk to actors about bad things. As a Stage Manager (which is such a vague term it means little) just do your best. remember that in much of pro theatre and TV, the entire thing can be falling down around you, but if your bit is going well - the bad bits are SEP - somebody else's problem. Do your job as well as you can do it. You need to lose the 'feeling responsible' thing - you don't get paid to take on a producer, or director's responsibility. In fact, if the show gets terrible notices, it's still valid on a CV - just one of those Stage Management ticks in a box. I've done quite a few shows over the years that have been terribly produced - poor advertising, poor technical, poor performance and they're still CV fodder - IF - you actually collect shows. I wish I had. I never collected names, dates and programmes - I cannot remember hundreds I must have done, but were just not memorable.

You sound very stressed about it. Don't be. You manage what you have got. If you think a project, ahead of start date, is clearly awful - you walk away, but pride wise - if you start, you see it through, warts and all. I worked on one show many times - a touring singer - always as far as I could see, paying people but the box office never being enough for my rough calculations on what everyone was paid. Too many performers, too many vehicles with set and kit and too many musicians to make it pay - then he er, got arrested and I think went to prison for certain activities - which he denied, but apparently the jury disbelieved. It's still a show you worked on, for the CV if you collect these things. 

 

As a Self-employed theatre and events person, most of your jobs come from your contacts. Nobody has ever asked for a list from me since 1994. Nowdays it's called networking, but that's where your name comes from. A friend of mine does sound - equipment and him as engineer. He has done this for some terrible band - truly dire. One off gigs that you know will never happen again. It doesn't hurt reputation - he holds no responsibility for performance quality. Maybe dark glasses and a disguise would help him not be seen cringing, but it's nothing to do with him. Why are you feeling guilty? It's a job. complete it, take the money and say no next time.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, BenKent2027 said:

From my understanding this Director/Producer has got all this money from their wealthy family, who appear to have invested quite a bit in this ‘theatre company’ of hers. She doesn’t have a day job, and doesn’t seem to have ever had one. Now the show has actually started I realise this is just a big ego trip, which is why I’m worried now about being paid.

I've had a few "reluctant" payers in my time - some never intended to pay, one "unbounced" her cheque when I mentioned the BECTU black-list, one bluffed it out when I threatened legal action (this was long before the online small-claims system existed) & some just went onto the "it's been a lovely relationship up to now, but this is where we part company" list, but funnily enough the one vanity project I recall was an absolute delight. A family in the biz hired a theatre as their daughter's 21st present, to put on Wizard of Oz.  Lots of industry help with the set, supportive siblings & friends (cast & audience), good houses & a really good vibe. You didn't always know who would deliver the cue line, but you could be absolutely confident that somebody would. And payment was instant.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Update: Just had a call from my employer. Due to COVID concerns at the venue, and many cancellations/angry emails/complaints, she has decided to close the panto. We are doing one last matinee on Friday, to ensure the cast’s family can see the show, and then that’s it. It sounds terrible, but I’m relieved it’s all over. I’ve been promised full payment and reimbursement of my travel too, which is good. This week has been a ###### show, but I’ve taught myself a lot about stage management over the last few weeks and I feel much more educated about the industry.

I highly suspect the reason for the show folding is complaints to the venue itself, which of course makes them look bad, and the obvious impact all of this has had on the cast (we’ve kept the bad reviews/reactions from them, but they can’t hide from a silent audience and awful costumes/set). I’m ready to do this one last show, and never speak of the experience again. It might turn itself into a funny story one day though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/14/2021 at 8:05 PM, Jivemaster said:

Sometimes you may not get paid!

Have to take issue with this. No-one should ever not get paid if payment was - as it should always be - part of the deal when taking on any engagement. As long as you've got something in writing - on paper or on an e-mail  - noting what the agreement was, there's no way you should ever adopt the position of shrugging your shoulders and thinking "ah well, I'll just write this one off to experience".

There's very specific legislation in place (search for Late Payment Of Commercial Debts) to enable you to take all necessary steps to recover what you're owed, including adding interest to outstanding payments and adding the costs of debt recovery to your claim.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, gareth said:

Have to take issue with this. No-one should ever not get paid if payment was - as it should always be - part of the deal when taking on any engagement. As long as you've got something in writing - on paper or on an e-mail  - noting what the agreement was, there's no way you should ever adopt the position of shrugging your shoulders and thinking "ah well, I'll just write this one off to experience".

That's true of course but I think you just have to accept the unpleasant reality of bad debts that simply aren't worth chasing through any system, and that applies in any business. If they won't pay, and serial non-payers are shameless, they won't pay.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Perhaps the OPs work provider is privately funded, and will pay everyone. Perhaps the learning curve has been steep for them too and funds are not coming in to pay debts already owed, we will never know. 

My experience has been in life that some people are not worth suing, that the original contracts and letters and phone calls of appointment are too leaky to stand up in court.

One of the take away points from all of this is to watch how contracts are made for services or employment 

Sometimes I think that the OP, though stressed, is fortunate to learn a lot of these lessons in a short single hit then be able to get out and recover.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

FWIW I think you should be more forgiving on the director than have been. Frankly a lot of new businesses are funded by the bank of mum & dad in the early days. Personally I think the university courses which give young people an unrealistic insight into show directing and present it as a plausible career option for a young graduate, are far more to blame for situations like this, than the parents who bankroll it. It sounds as though she's trying her best and clearly failing, probably due to a mixture of things she can't control and things she can but hasn't learned how to yet. But this is all an important part of her journey too. You have to respect that. There are experienced professional directors who go through the exact same emotions on much bigger commercial shows. You've been extremely unforgiving towards her in your post at a point in your career where I can only presume you're not quite perfect yourself yet either. I'd hold back on some of the criticism until you're blessed with a little more perspective.

Also do not forget that at the end of the day this person is still your client and you have a reasonable level of responsibility when it comes to confidentiality, whether or not the show makes you feel like crap. Everyone on this forum will have had a crappy client, the professionals are the ones who keep the details of that to themselves. You need to get over this, not take it personally, and keep the exact details of your gripes private. Sometimes you have to work for frustrating people but as long as it's them footing the bill, you should treat them much the same as you'd treat an award winning veteran. Also trust me the most talented director I ever worked for was by far the biggest pain in the backside... creativity and practicality often seem to be inversely proportionate.

You could have simply asked for advice on keeping your mojo when working on a show that's badly organised and is getting poor reviews. Everyone's been there. I don't think you needed to make it half as personal about the director as you have done - in terms of her age/experience/socio-economic background/parental backing/personal skills etc. Sounds like she's got a lot to learn but I'd be surprised if you don't too. Be more open to mistakes and be more forgiving. Bad shows exist across the entire spectrum and nobody does it on purpose.

Edited by dje
  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, dje said:

FWIW I think you should be more forgiving on the director than have been. ...   ...Be more open to mistakes and be more forgiving. Bad shows exist across the entire spectrum and nobody does it on purpose.

Wise words.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.