wee_merv Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Looking to mic a clarinet and just wondering if anyone has experience of any good mics to use? I am open to all suggestions across different price ranges, any feedback is much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 For recording or live use, and what kind of budget? I know you said you are open to different price e ranges, but the range is considerable. So is an AKG414 impossible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wee_merv Posted June 15, 2015 Author Share Posted June 15, 2015 Sorry forgot to mention it is for live use. I have been looking at clip on mics but am open to suggestions. To give a rough price bracket id put a top end price on £500. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Clip on mics work well where the stage is noisy - but suffer from giving the clarinet a very odd sound. Because the clarinet overblows a 12th, not an octave like a sax, the player has a choice of fingerings for many notes in the crossover - so one note can be played that has many of the holes closed - and is therefore very loud down the bore. Another fingering produces the same note, but with many pads up - meaning the volume from the mic will be less, and also the tone will be unbalanced, because so much of the tone is coming from much higher up the bore. With a sax, as you go up the notes, the tone changes gradually, and eq can do a pretty good job. I appreciate if it's a busy stage then a clip on may be the only solution, but the end isn't the best place. A small diaphragm condenser would probably be my first choice, and probably not a expensive one - although I did get some quite nice results with an AT 2020, which I don't like that much normally - but it captured the 'woody' sound quite well. The other reason for not liking clip on's on clarinets is that they are notoriously difficult to keep on. On a sax, particularly sopranos, a clip on dynamic - drum type, works quite well, and you can use a short XLR-XLR with a thinner than usual cable, and cable tie it to the lower pad guards, which stops it falling off when the player moves, but the thicker end of the clarinet doesn;t fit many of the clip on designer very well, and there is nowhere to use as a brain relief. DPA do some nice multi point attachments but are nearly as expensive as a decent mic! It is also good to experiment. An old friend used Sennheiser radio packs, elastic banded to the flare at the bottom, with the omni mic taped to a bit of wire coat hanger, bent to the middle of the bore. The surplus cable was then wound around the flare. Looked horrible, but he reckoned it sounded brilliant. I wasn't convinced? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkPAman Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 .... and there is nowhere to use as a brain relief. Well that's my problem, explained! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revbobuk Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Clip on mics work well where the stage is noisy - but suffer from giving the clarinet a very odd sound. Because the clarinet overblows a 12th, not an octave like a sax, the player has a choice of fingerings for many notes in the crossover - so one note can be played that has many of the holes closed - and is therefore very loud down the bore. Another fingering produces the same note, but with many pads up - meaning the volume from the mic will be less, and also the tone will be unbalanced, because so much of the tone is coming from much higher up the bore. With a sax, as you go up the notes, the tone changes gradually, and eq can do a pretty good job. I appreciate if it's a busy stage then a clip on may be the only solution, but the end isn't the best place. A small diaphragm condenser would probably be my first choice, and probably not a expensive one - although I did get some quite nice results with an AT 2020, which I don't like that much normally - but it captured the 'woody' sound quite well. Have to say that's one of the most comprehensive and helpful explanations of the rationale behind micing a clarinet I have ever encountered. Brilliant! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wpg3121 Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 I am aware it is double your ideal price, however may be somthing to think about or useful in the future, but Howarth sell a specialised clarinet and oboe clip on microphone which features two microphones to give a more even and balanced sound from the instrument. I have seen one on a clarinet and the player was incredibly happy with it. http://www.howarth.uk.com/pic.aspx?pic=./wo/saxmicamtws.jpg&pid=990015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 Now that is a device worthy of some credit - the price is, er, not quite so encouraging. Never seen it before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted June 16, 2015 Share Posted June 16, 2015 ... any feedback is much appreciated.Most audio folk try to avoid feedback, but if feedback is the goal, a cheap omni near the bell should do it every time! On a slightly more serious note, the one and only time I've been near a clarinet with a mic the answer was the aforementioned AKG 414, but that was in an "acoustic but louder" situation, and being bluntly honest, the 414 is a fabulous mic for pretty much anything, until real life limitations like stage volume get in the way, and something more practical but less lovely (or, perhaps, "less honest") sounding is called for. Another upvote for Paul's detailed and interesting discourse. The expensive weirdo mic is very interesting; the thing that caught my eye was the mix ratio for the two microphones, the 70% being from the body. Until I'd read Paul's piece, I would have struggled with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzendoz Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 I did get some quite nice results with an AT 2020, which I don't like that much normally - but it captured the 'woody' sound quite well. Interesting, if the 2020 sounds OK, you could try an AT2010 which really is a hand held 2020, same diaphragm. It would be easier to set up on stage and the feedback rejection should be better. Alan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ojc123 Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 From a previous thread of mine.http://www.blue-room.org.uk/index.php?showtopic=54703 I reckon just about any microphone/s would work but only if you make sure there's time to play with it/them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wee_merv Posted June 18, 2015 Author Share Posted June 18, 2015 Guys thanks a lot for all your feedback, very worthwhile to hear from you all and especially from Paulears who gave me an education as well as a suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 It's boring to most, but the way conical and cylindrical bore instruments work is quite fascinating - odd and even numbered harmonics in particular explain the sound you hear! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ojc123 Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 I now understand why the two cheap condenser mics gave a more even sound than the one decent mic when I did it. Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McIvy Posted June 22, 2015 Share Posted June 22, 2015 Paul's explanation is of course top hole.......... The bottom line here is that that as with most if not all wind instruments, the sounds (and I mean different sounds!) emanate from all around the instrument, not just the flare of the bell end. From the reed vibration at one end, each and every finger or key hole, through to the potentially loudest noise at the flare, not forgetting the vibration of the instrument body itself. For that reason, distant mic'ing with a decent condenser will always give you the most natural sound. So, live sound capture is always going to be a compromise, so as to avoid howl. In my experience and for critical belt and braces, the double approach of a good well positioned stand mic of your choice and a wireless cardioid combination works best. The stand mic takes priority, but if your player gets carried away and drifts off-mic, you can bring in the wireless for safety backup, give or take the odd phase issue. A best quality Dynamic with a spot of EQ may also work well. You should find that the best pro players already know good mic technique with their instrument, whilst the more inexperienced will do more of the drifting away. A beautiful instrument in the right hands and lips. McIvy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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