D&B Qsub/Q7

[Bothy Cat]

We're looking to upgrade our band PA system (Martin Audio WS2A/W3P per side) to a D&B system, suitable for function rooms for up to 300, but with flexibility to do marquees up to about 600 capacity fairly regularly. We've got one or two options on the used/ex hire market, and this gear seems to have the ideal mix of quality, size & weight, but just wanted to get an opinion:

1. If we go down this road, is 2 x Qsub and 1 x Q7 an appropriate mix per side (with 2 x D12), or should it be 2 x Qsub and 2 x Q7 per side, and

2. With new v used prices only around 30% of a difference, we may stretch to buying an element of the equipment new. On a priority basis, is it better to go for the D12s, Qsubs or Q7s new with the rest used (assuming all used in good condition/working order but all around 5 years old).

Many thanks

Mike

[gibbothegreat]

We're looking to upgrade our band PA system (Martin Audio WS2A/W3P per side) to a D&B system, suitable for function rooms for up to 300, but with flexibility to do marquees up to about 600 capacity fairly regularly. We've got one or two options on the used/ex hire market, and this gear seems to have the ideal mix of quality, size & weight, but just wanted to get an opinion:

1. If we go down this road, is 2 x Qsub and 1 x Q7 an appropriate mix per side (with 2 x D12), or should it be 2 x Qsub and 2 x Q7 per side, and

2. With new v used prices only around 30% of a difference, we may stretch to buying an element of the equipment new. On a priority basis, is it better to go for the D12s, Qsubs or Q7s new with the rest used (assuming all used in good condition/working order but all around 5 years old).

Many thanks

Mike

 

What sort of stuff do you play? If it's bass heavy/rock, yep, go for 2 subs, if it's jazz/ easy listening one will suffice. Re buying new, the great advantage is the 5-year guarantee that d&b offer, and in the light of that I'd be inclined to go for the Q7s new, as in my experience they were the most likely to fail (although incidence of that was extremely low, maybe four or five times over a period of 8 years with a stock of about 30 of each speaker, and 100s of D12s. Think I remember one D12 failure in that time, and no Q-subs at all... )

[TonyMitchell]

Unless you need the coverage, or will use the second pair for front fills, one Q7 box per side on FOH should be sufficient. You could of course consider Q10 instead of Q7 if you'd prefer the extra 35deg horizontal.

 

A Q7 wound up nice & high and tilted down, over a pair of Q-SUBs per side is very versatile. If you find yourself using a single Q-SUB per side for smaller events, you'll probably want to trim the Q7 back a few dB.

 

The 'marquee for 600' thing can sometimes be a little more challenging, as the tent won't always have the height (or at least, not in the right place) where you want to get your tops up high. We typically dot pairs of E8 around in that scenario as fills, to give the low volume coverage required in seated areas.

[PatrickSmith]

Is there any reason you are specifically considering d&b?

 

There are some great L-acoustics options that are pretty comparable in terms of sound quality but could offer you much more bang for your buck. Something like a 12XT would give you wider coverage than a Q7 (it's 90 degree conical) and is half the price, so you'd be able to build a larger and mare adaptable system within your budget. You can power this with 2 subs (15" or 18" both also cheaper than a Q-sub) in stereo off a single LA4. There are also powered versions (the 112P) available which could be ideal for your kind of application, typically you save a bit on the price of amplifiers and also save space.

 

So, exploring different manufacturers could save you quite a bit of money.... or for the Q-series budget you could explore a higher end system. Something like the new L-Acoustics ARCS WIFO would blow you away and is the same kind of ball park as your Q series system.

 

I have both these systems available to demo if you'd like to come and have a listen.

[Dave SA]

Really not sure Q is the right system for 750 people. Certainly not Q7...

[gibbothegreat]

Really not sure Q is the right system for 750 people. Certainly not Q7...

:huh: What would be the problem with it for that?

 

 

 

[Dave SA]

Arraying multiple Q7 for a start. Not sure there's much need to go beyond that point.

[Matt Riley]

Really not sure Q is the right system for 750 people. Certainly not Q7...

Thankfully the OP is only talking about 600! I'm guessing here, but it also sounds a lot like Mike is talking about a function band situation, which could have very different expectations of SPL levels to the average 'screaming fans' kind of gig, especially as the challenge is often getting it loud enough at the front for the keen ones, while still allowing Great Auntie Nora to sit at the back and knock back the G&Ts in peace!

 

Q is a safe option, although probably not the cheapest upfront one (the total cost of ownership over the lifetime of the system would probably be very reasonable). It is always worth approaching various distributors with your spec and seeing what they can put together though. Q series is a pretty old design nowadays - it must be coming up to what - 8 years old, and D&B's competitors haven't been standing still.

[Dave SA]

His profile states that he plays to audiences of 750 in a function band.

 

Some functions may well expect to be able to hear everything clearly at the back, and why not?

 

If you chose a system capable of this then it will always be possible to decrease the spl at the back (whether by removing elements or by using tilt boards).

 

If we are talking about advising a man on spending Q7 money, then the end result should be nothing short of absolute perfection no?

[gibbothegreat]

Arraying multiple Q7 for a start. Not sure there's much need to go beyond that point.

 

Don't understand what you mean by this...?

[gibbothegreat]

His profile states that he plays to audiences of 750 in a function band.

 

Some functions may well expect to be able to hear everything clearly at the back, and why not?

 

If you chose a system capable of this then it will always be possible to decrease the spl at the back (whether by removing elements or by using tilt boards).

 

If we are talking about advising a man on spending Q7 money, then the end result should be nothing short of absolute perfection no?

 

He also specifies what his current PA is, and at the least implies he's using this already in these kind of venues, so it's a little unlikely that he's playing the sort of gig where it does need to be screaming fans levels. I'm further guessing that he may be talking about d&b because he's tried it and liked it, and it's worked for him in the gigs he's done. If he is indeed looking to upgrade from his current set up and not change scale, the d&b will be a very good choice. Which isn't to say there aren't others, but the Q series is still a highly potent piece of kit. Anyone who can't get a good sound out of it really shouldn't be in this game, is how good it is.

[Bothy Cat]

His profile states that he plays to audiences of 750 in a function band.

 

Some functions may well expect to be able to hear everything clearly at the back, and why not?

 

If you chose a system capable of this then it will always be possible to decrease the spl at the back (whether by removing elements or by using tilt boards).

 

If we are talking about advising a man on spending Q7 money, then the end result should be nothing short of absolute perfection no?

 

He also specifies what his current PA is, and at the least implies he's using this already in these kind of venues, so it's a little unlikely that he's playing the sort of gig where it does need to be screaming fans levels. I'm further guessing that he may be talking about d&b because he's tried it and liked it, and it's worked for him in the gigs he's done. If he is indeed looking to upgrade from his current set up and not change scale, the d&b will be a very good choice. Which isn't to say there aren't others, but the Q series is still a highly potent piece of kit. Anyone who can't get a good sound out of it really shouldn't be in this game, is how good it is.

Thanks very much for all the superb advice folks. Your absolutely bang on in that we're pretty much a function band (with full back line and a rock edge to the set) that plays a wide range of gigs from function rooms and halls upwards, which over the summer includes a number of marquee dances for up to 600(stage and one end, bar at the other jobs). The flexibility that this kit gives us is ideal, the kit is straightforward for us to set up quick, its light and its compact and the coverage is way beter than we have at the moment. We've used this gear on 3-4 occassions in the past on a hire basis, and it ticks the boxes no question, and want to have our own. We've decided to go for brand new pairs of Q7's and Qsubs, and an ex hire second pair of Qsubs and ex hire for both D12's. From what everyone has said this kit has very low incidence of breakdown which is important to us due to our rural location. The used value is not really a consideration as we will have no intention of selling on for quite a while, but its good to know the depreciation is low nonetheless.

Merry Christmas to all!

[TonyMitchell]

We've decided to go for brand new pairs of Q7's and Qsubs, and an ex hire second pair of Qsubs and ex hire for both D12's. From what everyone has said this kit has very low incidence of breakdown which is important to us due to our rural location. The used value is not really a consideration as we will have no intention of selling on for quite a while, but its good to know the depreciation is low nonetheless.

Merry Christmas to all!

 

You won't be disappointed, it's an excellent, versatile, compact modular system, which you can always build upon if things get bigger for you (by adding Q1, more QSUBs, etc.)

 

I recommend you invest in a pair of Z5013 M20 stand winders and Z5161 flying brackets so you can optimise the height of your Q7s and their tilt angles for each deployment.

 

Tony

[dco_uk]

1356445263[/url]' post='460216']

1356389243[/url]' post='460203'] We've decided to go for brand new pairs of Q7's and Qsubs, and an ex hire second pair of Qsubs and ex hire for both D12's. From what everyone has said this kit has very low incidence of breakdown which is important to us due to our rural location. The used value is not really a consideration as we will have no intention of selling on for quite a while, but its good to know the depreciation is low nonetheless.

Merry Christmas to all!

 

You won't be disappointed, it's an excellent, versatile, compact modular system, which you can always build upon if things get bigger for you (by adding Q1, more QSUBs, etc.)

 

I recommend you invest in a pair of Z5013 M20 stand winders and Z5161 flying brackets so you can optimise the height of your Q7s and their tilt angles for each deployment.

 

Tony

 

K&m do a winch stand (21339) which work out much cheaper than the d&b version. Thomann are doing them at under £100 each INC vat.