Behringer LC2412 with QLab

[Angus]

Can anyone tell me whether the Behringer's LC2412 console works with QLab?

Does anyone know how to contact Behringer to ask them such questions?!

Thanks in advance,

Angus

[benweblight]

The only way they will talk to each other as far as I know is MIDI.

For this you would need a midi interface for your Mac (i.e. those made by Edirol)

 

The LC2412 actually has a reasonable MIDI implementation of most features of the desk, the channels that relate to different functions can be found on Pg. 23 of the manual. You could setup Qlab to trigger scenes etc. in the desk using midi cues...but from experience do not expect a smooth dimming response for theatrical uses this way. Also not sure whether Midi cues are included in the free version of Qlab.

 

What are you trying to acheive?

[Angus]

Hi Ben, thanks for that.

I'm taking a small show on the road, to a mixture of village halls and studio theatres.

 

 

For village halls I'm thinking of using the following set up for lighting and sound cues:

QLab on as high a spec G4 iBook as I can find, connected to the Behringer LC2412 via a bus-powered MOTU Micro Express for MIDI (which I happen already to have). And all of this controlling three 4-channel dimmer packs (eg Cobra ones).

 

I'll have a dozen or so lights, mostly 500W each. With 12 channels to play with I'm guessing I should be alright, as long as they're not all on at once.

 

I'm assuming I can achieve reasonably convincing lighting fades - how noticeably stuttered are they? - and hopefully control a smoke machine and mirror ball via the analogue output on the LC2412 at the same time.

 

I'll be buying the license for Midi cues off QLab.

 

For the dimmer packs would you say I'm better off with 3-pin or 5-pin DMX?

 

For studio theatres, I'm hoping I will be able to use soft patch on the LC2412 to control the venue's own dimmers and lights....does that sound realistic?

 

Sorry, I'm a bit green and under-financed!

[benweblight]

The problem is that Midi is an 8-bit protocol (with values from 0-128) and DMX is 16bit (with values 0-255) giving less accurate control and I did find I got noticeable stuttering when running the LC2412 from MIDI. This may not be so much of a problem if you were triggering the 'go' stack on the desk (but that is really painful to program). There is also some inherent latency in Midi systems that may or may not be a problem. Not to mention that the behringer does not do great fades to start with...

 

I think in your situation I might look into a software DMX control solution; there are a few available for mac now such as MagicQ, CueLux etc. and you can get basic interfaces for under £100. I'm not sure about running lights and sound from the same machine but this is in theory possible; also this would probably be better if you were to go into venues that have more than 24 dimmer channels.

 

Your idea regarding dimmers sounds good as you can always run them from different sockets to spread the load abit where power is limited.

There are several threads on here discussing the 5pin/3pin debate but in reality it probably won't matter that much...cheap 4-channel dimmers tend to be on 3-pin; you can get adapters between 3 and 5 if needed.

[Shez]

The problem is that Midi is an 8-bit protocol (with values from 0-128) and DMX is 16bit (with values 0-255) giving less accurate control

Each DMX channel was 8 bit last time I looked... And when you use two channels as a 16 bit pair, for pan & tilt for example, that gives you 65536 discrete values.

[Angus]

I assume a software DMX solution would not use MIDI and that is why you can get smooth fades. However, I've had a look at MagicQ and CueLux but from what I can gather neither of them seem designed to integrate sound and lighting cues, something I am after (eg an LX cue following on from a sound cue or vice versa).

 

 

Perhaps I can get round the smooth fade issue if, as you suggest, I use Qlab just to trigger cues preset on the LC2412 - is that much more painful to program than if I was programming the desk?

 

NB we won't be using LED lights which I gather are more susceptible to stuttered fades than incandescent.

[dbuckley]

There are tools that integrate sound and lighting, freeing you of the need to connect stuff together with MIDI; PCStage is one, and ShowMagic is another. I do shows with the PCStage running everything on a fairly regular basis. PCStage does proper dimming.

 

However... Not a Mac package though which may be an issue for you :)

[Angus]

Alas, yes, I'm looking to run it on a Mac.

[Ian der Laan]

Apparently, it runs fine with the Windows emulator. Not tried it though.

[benweblight]

Perhaps I can get round the smooth fade issue if, as you suggest, I use Qlab just to trigger cues preset on the LC2412 - is that much more painful to program than if I was programming the desk?

 

The problem is fading between the cues...unless you run the desk in 'theatre mode' which I found was very awkward to edit as you go if you want to alter cues.

 

What I was thinking was...in the absence of something that will do both lights and sound would be to use two separate applications midi linked internally (using a virtual driver i.e. http://notahat.com/midi_patchbay) but I haven't been able to actually try this out so not sure how well this would work in reality. Maybe running a dual boot of Windows and running one of the all-in-one show control apps would be better.

[Angus]

is the Behringer LC2412 so much of a pain to programme that it is best avoided? I guess the next step up would be a second hand Jester....a fair bit more pricey...

I expect I will be editing cues now and then (ie adding/removing) - will this cause proper headaches on the LC2412?

Thanks

[Angus]

I've ducked out of the LC2412 route and gone for the Enttec DMX USB PRO with QLab and MidiStageConsole.

Thanks for all the advice!