crazytom999 Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 We are a relatively small church, with a relatively small budget to upgrade our lighting system. We currenty have a Eurolight LC2412 console controlling our DMX fixtures. We want to replace this with a computer controlled lighting desk. That is not a problem. What we need is the ability to place a small 3 or 4 button keypad out in the hallway which will allow someone with NO knowledge of lighting to walk up and turn on the lights in our Sanctuary, and turn them off again. During normal service times, we will need to take control from the computer desk. Is there an inexpensive way to do this? We have people who are knowledgeable enough to build kits with proper instructions. Help..
themadhippy Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 easiest way would be a 2 way switch,common to the light,1 to dimmer 2 to permanent live,only downside is they can be switched to full on at anytime
crazytom999 Posted January 30, 2011 Author Posted January 30, 2011 easiest way would be a 2 way switch,common to the light,1 to dimmer 2 to permanent live,only downside is they can be switched to full on at anytime We had thought of that, but there is no way to "take control" of the fixtures from the lighting desk when the switch is in the 'on' position. We have also thought of getting a small wall mount DMX controller, and switching the DMX data line between the two. The problem with that would be if the operator forgot to give control back to the wall controller after a service. Another issue is that the majority of our fixtures are plugged into portable dimmer packs. So, they are going to have to be controlled via DMX.
mac.calder Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 If the desk stays on 24/7, you could use the remote capabilities of whatever software you decide - some software can take input via RS-232, midi messages, TCP/IP etc. Then the PC application can be used for operating, and the usual laws of precedence apply (leave the "general" cue lists as low priority and bob's your uncle). Midi button pad (obtainable for <$50) could then act as your light switches. Another option... Do your dimmers only have DMX in? - it is a long shot (as you say these are portable dimmers) but some have architectural inputs which you can use to trigger playback states on the dimmer. They are basically dry relay contacts, which have a power pin then a number of 'preset' pins. By shorting the power to a preset pin, the dimmer will recall a pre-programmed state.
Matthew Robinson Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 If people are happy with your current control desk, have you considered a DMX Merger? A quick Google shows one at about £150, obviously, this may be outside your price range. Basically, they work by taking the DMX stream from two inputs and merging them together, with the value sent out either being the highest value that has been sent by either input (Highest Takes Precedence) or the latest value that has been sent (Latest Takes Precedence). Although, there could be a problem in that if someone left all the channels up on the current desk, you'd have no control with your new desk. E2A: sorry, that doesn't answer your query, although, if you got hold of a switch that turned the correct channels up to full, it's workable (but probably overkill)
dbuckley Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 We have also thought of getting a small wall mount DMX controller, and switching the DMX data line between the two. Thats what I would do. The problem with that would be if the operator forgot to give control back to the wall controller after a service. Use the Artistic Licence "Light Switch" wall mount DMX controller. Get a pair of triple pole double throw switches, and wire a simple two-way between the desk out wallplate and the wall controller, so either party can switch the dimmers to wall plate or desk. DMX needs two poless of the switch, the third is for an LED at both ends so there is no confusion over who has control.
PaulDF Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 To control the house lights in our theatre I installed a system with a 4 normal light switches for normal use and a change over system with a keyswitch which changes it over to a hard wired dimmer pack. The change over has 5 relays in it, one for each light and one to power the dimmer. I'll see if I can dig out the wiring diagram if you like?
lampygirl Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Possibly a bit more technical, but provides an alternative to the set of switches, is to allow users to VNC in to the lighting computer over network and hit a master button. This requires a little more computer knowledge to set up, but we've had it so nightclub managers, and even admin or non-venue staff can connect and hit a master button on sunlite/showcad which allows them to come in and clean up, or do setups in the daytime, all from the convenience of their laptop or office desktop computer. This might not solve your problem, but depending on the technical (rather than lighting) knowledge of your people you may find it easier than playing with hardware and if they already have PCs setup elsewhere in the venue it can be cost efficient.
Don Allen Posted January 31, 2011 Posted January 31, 2011 If you have people that can put electronic circuits together, then one solution requires several modules.Use relays to switch the DMX line from the houselight dimmer between the main desk DMX out ( will probably need to be from a DMX splitter ) and the DMX feed from the wall plate. A normally open momentary switch on the wall plate will turn on a self latching relay so two poles can switch the DMX. A third pole is used to latch the relay, but has a normally closed momentary switch located at the main desk, labelled house light control, so it will de-enrgise the relay to change to house light dimmer back to the main desk output. Or you can use a DMX relay controlled from the main desk as the normally closed switch, seems a bit too complicated for this job. Go to the Microchip website and download their DMX transmitter circuit. Use slider faders instead of switches and you do not have to change the code.AN1076A DMX Transmitter. This will supply the DMX control to the house light dimmer. Architectural controls like this do exist, they may be outside your budget. The advantage of the above approach is that it is all low volts. The disadvantage is that the remote wall plate can turn on your house lights during a show as you want a system where the main desk operator dous not have to remember to switch house light control back to the wall plate.
TomHoward Posted January 31, 2011 Posted January 31, 2011 What dimmers are you using, or is it to turn on the DMX fixtures? Our dimmers have an open contact in on each channel, so you can wire a light switch in to the dimmer and just over-ride.
sleah Posted January 31, 2011 Posted January 31, 2011 If the dimmers have both DMX and 0-10v inputs (Our Beta2's have) then you could wire a simple switch to pull the relevent channels to 10v using the analogue inputs....Dunno if this would work in practise, having DMX & analogue connected at the same time as I haven't tried it, but you won't kill the dimmers trying it out B-)
crazytom999 Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 If you have people that can put electronic circuits together, then one solution requires several modules.Use relays to switch the DMX line from the houselight dimmer between the main desk DMX out ( will probably need to be from a DMX splitter ) and the DMX feed from the wall plate. A normally open momentary switch on the wall plate will turn on a self latching relay so two poles can switch the DMX. A third pole is used to latch the relay, but has a normally closed momentary switch located at the main desk, labelled house light control, so it will de-enrgise the relay to change to house light dimmer back to the main desk output. Or you can use a DMX relay controlled from the main desk as the normally closed switch, seems a bit too complicated for this job. Go to the Microchip website and download their DMX transmitter circuit. Use slider faders instead of switches and you do not have to change the code.AN1076A DMX Transmitter. This will supply the DMX control to the house light dimmer. The disadvantage is that the remote wall plate can turn on your house lights during a show as you want a system where the main desk operator dous not have to remember to switch house light control back to the wall plate. The relay and associated pushbutton switches are easy enough to install. While we have people who can assemble a kit, or follow a complete, functional schematic to assemble the transmitter, the link does not appear to provide that. Additionally, I have no clue how to get the furnished code into the PIC. Will do more research on that. Does someone not sell an inexpensive DMX transmitter that can be programmed via either the USB or serial port of a computer to output designated channels at 100%? All we really need is to be able to turn on a select set of fixtures from the hallway, with the push of 1 button. I can 'lock-out' the hallway button for up to 6 hours with a spring wound timer (using NC contacts) to disable the hallway button.
IRW Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 The relay and associated pushbutton switches are easy enough to install. While we have people who can assemble a kit, or follow a complete, functional schematic to assemble the transmitter, the link does not appear to provide that. Additionally, I have no clue how to get the furnished code into the PIC. Will do more research on that. Does someone not sell an inexpensive DMX transmitter that can be programmed via either the USB or serial port of a computer to output designated channels at 100%? All we really need is to be able to turn on a select set of fixtures from the hallway, with the push of 1 button. I can 'lock-out' the hallway button for up to 6 hours with a spring wound timer (using NC contacts) to disable the hallway button. You've still not told us what manufacturer/model dimmers they are- as Sleah hinted at, there could be a really easy way to do this if they have both analogue (of any flavour) and DMX connections!
crazytom999 Posted February 5, 2011 Author Posted February 5, 2011 You've still not told us what manufacturer/model dimmers they are- as Sleah hinted at, there could be a really easy way to do this if they have both analogue (of any flavour) and DMX connections! The current dimmers are LSC portable units.. DMX control ONLY. The DMX relay packs will be Blue Point Engineering DMX - 3001. They too are DMX only.
dbuckley Posted February 5, 2011 Posted February 5, 2011 Does someone not sell an inexpensive DMX transmitter that can be programmed via either the USB or serial port of a computer to output designated channels at 100%?Yes, almost, I recommended such a product above, its not "cheap", but its good value, and given you (and your group) don't appear to have the chops to build something similar in short order, I'd again recommend the Artistic Licence "light switch".
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