Abstract Futurescan Pro III M33 DMX problem

[Simon-R]

Hi everyone, before I tell you my problem id just like to say hi and I have used this website a few times but always forgot to register, I hope someone can help me with my problem as ive been playing around with it for nearly 2 weeks now.

 

My problem is I have 4 Abstract Futurescan Pro III M33's and I have been trying to DMX them togeather to run as Master/Slave and also to run them from my laptop using usb/DMX cable and Freestyler software.

 

As I said above I have been playing around with them for nearly 2 weeks now and just cant seen to get them to work togeather, a friend of mine came up with his DMX tester (XLR/DMX with green LED ontop) he tested all 4 of the lights but none of them seem to be responding, now I have bought these lights second hand and I know they are pretty old lights but I find it hard to believe that all 4 lights have lost DMX function.

 

I have tryed looking all over the internet for the original manual for the lights but cant seem to find one so I am really lost at the moment.

 

These lights only have 6 Dip Switches and the last dip switch is for stand alone mode wich works 100%, I can run all 4 lights as stand alone and they are great but as you may know lights do look even better when they are working togeather.

 

So if anyone can help me it would be great, would like to get them working for next weekend.

[paulears]

When you tried them individually, did you swap pins 2 and 3? The Futurescans we have are reverse wired, needing the hot/cold swap. That said, assuming they look like this

http://www.matrixproductions.com.au/images/gallery/Equipment/Futurescan_3.gif

then they should also have sound to light capability, and if you link them up, the first one, when it has no DMX input should automatically output DMX and they should all work together. When you link them up, there is an LED to indicate DMX is present. Does that light up?

 

manual here

 

 

EDIT 5/2013 - sorry, the linked image file has vanished. Paul

[Simon-R]

yes they do look like that... 2 of them have a red led on the top and they are on everytime I turn the lights on, the other 2 dont have led's on the top but they do have green led's inside the head of the light thats on the pcb board

[paulears]

The LEDs on mine are red and green, if it helps - the manual I just added doesn't help that much really.

[Simon-R]

yea I noticed that when I bought them, there is no visable green (DMX) light, there is only red (power) led on 2 of them and none on the other 2... but on the PCB board there are green led lights wich light up when the units are running, I cant seem to make any sence of it

 

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http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/3521/img0063cq.jpg

 

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/6114/img0065ac.jpg

 

 

 

 

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as you can see from the pics, the top one has red led light but no green light and the other one has no led's at all, but there is a hole where I think one should be, so is it possiable that someone has changed the pcb boards in them or have broken the led's

 

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think I might have figured it... I have just looked at one of my XLR cables and it goes left to right 2/3/1 now on the lights it goes left to right 1/3/2.. so does that mean they are inverted and I need to re-solder my XLR cables?

[paulears]

no - they're just backwards because they're mirror images. However, the Futurecans are all wired backwards internally, so don't resolder your XLRs, it doesn't matter. If you have a spare one, swap the connections to pins 2 and 3 at just one end, Mark the cable with POLARITY REVERSED - or some other warning sign, and use this cable from whatever you are controlling them with - this will almost certainly result in at least 1 of them responding. The only other people sometimes do is get the dip switch settings inverted - the little diagrams showing which switches are up and which ones are down can be read the wrong way so you could have set these wrong too!

[Simon-R]

ok, thanks for your help... I still dont totaly understand it but ill try a few things and see what happens,

 

Thanks again.

 

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is there any reason why I cant change the dip switches "on the fly" cos it seems I have to turn the light off then change the dip and then turn the light back on again, Also the power switch has 2 settings, all the way to the left is off, then you can put it to the middle but nothing happens, then all the way right is on.

[paulears]

What don't you understand? The Polarity reversal thing?

 

Firstly - you can fiddle with the dip switches when it's fired up and running - to be honest the only way to go really.

 

For some odd reason, when Abstract designed these they used the DMX spec, but reversed the polarity of the DMX feed. It didn't matter a hoot as their dedicated controller output the DMX signal and the fixtures were perfectly happy. The trouble is the other manufacturers did it the other way, so many of us keep some polarity converters in the tool box. You can buy these for a few quid and the pin 2 and 3 wiring is swapped inside. They have a male on one end and a female on the other, so if you wire up a pile of DMX kit and one particular type of fixture doesn't respond, a quick insert of the swapover adapter shows if it's a polarity problem. To try yours, just do the 2/3 changeover in one of the connector shells - then use that between controller and first unit. The reason you need to mark it is so you don't try to use it where it's not needed - because the no response problem will shift to another good unit and confuse you or somebody else.

[david.elsbury]

Last time I played with these lights (which was quite some time ago admittedly) we found that after changing the dip switches we had to re-power the units, this being to do with getting them out of master/slave mode and into DMX mode.

 

And confirming what Paul says- they need a pin 2/3 swap.

[timsabre]

This discussion shows why Abstract should have chosen different names for all their units!!

 

The Futurescan Pro III M33, as the original poster describes, has no master-slave function, a 6-way dipswitch, and requires turning off and on to change the address. It uses black radio-control servos on the pan-tilt mirror. It only has a red power light. They are prone to blowing up because the toroidal transformer inside is not properly secured and rubs against the aluminium extrusion causing a short circuit. This unit was designed for Abstract by the guy who later went on to start Mad Lighting.

 

The unit Paul is describing with red/green LEDs is the Futurescan 3CE, which also took an M33 lamp (and had a discharge lamp version the 3CED). This had 10 dipswitches which could be changed with the power on, and a very sophisticated master-slave system which was copied by various chinese companies. This unit and the other "CE range" units was designed by me.

 

The reason for the pin 2-3 reversal is that at the time we designed them, most companies were using pin 2 "hot" on 3 pin DMX - Martin, NJD, Ryger etc, so we did the same. This was very early in the development of DMX, 1994 I think.

[paulears]

That's really useful info, Tim - Thanks for that. I can confirm the ones I have are the CED versions with the discharge lamps - I have to admit to not knowing about the other versions. Things were developing pretty fast then, I guess.

[Simon-R]

Thanks for all the information guys, its been very useful and after 2 weeks of searching the internet I havent found any info about them.

 

So to finish off, the futurescan lights I have dont have a master/slave mode right? but if I do the 2/3 swap can I still get them to function with a usb/DMX cable using freestyler? because then atleast I could setup a sequence for them to work togeather sort of a mimick of master/slave mode?

[timsabre]

Thanks for all the information guys, its been very useful and after 2 weeks of searching the internet I havent found any info about them.

 

So to finish off, the futurescan lights I have dont have a master/slave mode right? but if I do the 2/3 swap can I still get them to function with a usb/DMX cable using freestyler? because then atleast I could setup a sequence for them to work togeather sort of a mimick of master/slave mode?

 

Correct, there is no master-slave.

 

You definitely need to swap pins 2-3, but even if you do this they may not work with a USB DMX-dongle. The DMX reception on them is quite basic and sometimes does not work with full speed DMX (i.e. with no idle time in between the DMX data bytes). The old Abstract Gladiator HLX units (the cylindrical ones) have the same problem.

[Simon-R]

thanks for the information once again..

 

Could it be possable to control them with a universal controller?

 

I have seen some on ebay wich arnt bad prices and some also say they have DMX polarity selector, would these work the lights?

 

 

Thanks.

[timsabre]

thanks for the information once again..

 

Could it be possable to control them with a universal controller?

 

I have seen some on ebay wich arnt bad prices and some also say they have DMX polarity selector, would these work the lights?

 

 

Thanks.

 

There is a better chance of them working with a stand-alone controller (rather than a pc-based one) as they do tend to send out the DMX data with more gaps. But you would have to try it to be sure.