gilkinted Posted August 24, 2010 Share Posted August 24, 2010 This 50 piece plus choir are performing on a bandstand in the open air. Can't mention their name but they've just become famous! Got to provide some 're-enforcement' P.A. for the listeners seated and standing around on the grass. I think the expectation is to cater mainly for those within an approximate thirty feet distance from stage (in the round). There are no spot vocals. Would a single crossed pair cover it as the Choir are professional and project well? Or could I feasibly use repeated pairs of dynamics around the bandstand to support the condensers? Mic complement is a mix of C1000's (pair), SM58's (two pairs) and some Behringer electrets and dynamics - all pairs. Also - I thought for P.A. cover six quality passive full range cabs on sticks (JBL/Logic) located around the Bandstand exterior, each fed by 1k, would be adequate. Insanity or what? Cheers - Allan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallMike Posted August 24, 2010 Share Posted August 24, 2010 Don't forget the fluffles for the mics... Hang them from the roof if it's possible. Else, on stands in front of the choir - never expect them to project well.. no matter what the MD says! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbsy Posted August 24, 2010 Share Posted August 24, 2010 A 52 member professional choir will be able to project more than 30 feet even outdoors. At most, you need a bit of light reinforcement to add some fullness (unless you're try to achieve silly sorts of level). I'd stick to a pair of crossed cardioid condensers or maybe spaced omnis. I wouldn't try to add extra mikes. The more you have open, the more risk you have of comb filter/phase issues and it might also start to impact on gain before feedback. One thing I'd seriously do is hire a pair a better mics than your C1000s. They are NOT a good choice for female vocals, tending to harshness in the upper registers. Practically any small diaphragm condenser will be better. As for your speaker choice, I guess just get them up on sticks, aimed down at the crowd. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shez Posted August 24, 2010 Share Posted August 24, 2010 I'm a little confused by all the mentions of crossed pairs when you say the audience is in the round. Trying to do stereo in the round outdoors with 6 cabs just ain't going to happen. Get a good mono mix going with however many mics you need to get good coverage of the whole choir and send that to each speaker. You'll likely need a bit less level at the front than you will in other directions. Spend a bit of time before the choir even get there ensuring you have sufficient clean gain in the system with no ringing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilkinted Posted August 24, 2010 Author Share Posted August 24, 2010 I'm a little confused by all the mentions of crossed pairs when you say the audience is in the round. Trying to do stereo in the round outdoors with 6 cabs just ain't going to happen. Get a good mono mix going with however many mics you need to get good coverage of the whole choir and send that to each speaker. You'll likely need a bit less level at the front than you will in other directions. Spend a bit of time before the choir even get there ensuring you have sufficient clean gain in the system with no ringing. Well spotted Shez! I am ashamed at this obvious oversight. Mono input off air - of course - is what is required and this together with other previous comments has helped point me in the right direction. Any thoughts, anyone on a specific condenser for the job? Allan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted August 24, 2010 Share Posted August 24, 2010 For a choir Ive had decent results with C568eb mics in crossed pair format, so I guess I'd try them in non-crossed-pair for this app. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobbsy Posted August 25, 2010 Share Posted August 25, 2010 I thought about the stereo/in-the-round issue--but a crossed pair can still be an effective mic technique even if you're planning to mix it down to mono. Crossing the mics is a good way to get double the coverage from a relatively close range--but not get the comb filter/phase issues that can be a problem with a spaced pair. This can be a noticeable issue at certain frequencies when you mix down to mono. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
back_ache Posted August 25, 2010 Share Posted August 25, 2010 I have heard a few outdoor choirs done badly and it has always been the case that the engineer hasn't been mixing out where the audience are. I know it is much more convenient to site the mixer close to the choir, but the benefits of mixing from where the audience are numerous and outweigh the hassle of running out power and a multicore Oh, and don't be afraid of being creative, I had good results at one gig when I found a SM58 that someone had left pointing at the stages ceiling gave a lovely full sound! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
allgoodnamesaretaken Posted August 25, 2010 Share Posted August 25, 2010 Over the years I have amassed some experience with Choirs both indoors and outdoors ..... a couple of questions though ...... Are they singing unaccompanied?What style of music are they performing?You say they project ..... have you worked with them before and do they really Stephen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gilkinted Posted August 26, 2010 Author Share Posted August 26, 2010 Over the years I have amassed some experience with Choirs both indoors and outdoors ..... a couple of questions though ...... Are they singing unaccompanied?What style of music are they performing?You say they project ..... have you worked with them before and do they really Stephen Unaccompanied? - Yes (apart from backing track for two songs)Style of music? - Mix of Pop, Gospel, MOR & ballads (re-worked)Project? - No I haven't but yes they do! Allan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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