O- Licence for hired vehicles

[dwents]

Hi Guys I know a current topic is running on training but I wanted some specific advice which I didnt wan't to get buried on the last page of the other thread.

 

My question is I run a Marquee company and require a 7.5 ton truck my licence allows me to drive it?

The Opererators licence is the thing causing the problem I have a farm I have the funds to buy the vehicle just cant justify the money to be tied up 8 grand I think is the figure plus about 2 grand in fees to get it plus the service checks etc

 

Does anyone know a way I can hire a truck legally for business use as I an drive it on my licence but without all the fees and red tape required as that seems daft as the hire company have to do that as part of their operators licence.

I understand part of the licence reflects parking it when not in use and making sure you know what your doing etc I just dont want to have to have 8-10 grand sitting in the bank just to hire a vehicle.

 

the only other way is to hire a man and van with a o licence but that seems crazy when I have several people including myself capable to drive

 

any advice is very welcome

[gareth]

If you use ('operate') a qualifying vehicle in the course of your business, you need an operators' licence regardless of whether the vehicle is owned by you or hired in. I went through this in some depth with the Traffic Office in Birmingham a few years ago, and there's no way around it.

[Dodgecaliber]

As a haulier myself, if you wish to operate/drive a vehicle over 3.5 ton you need an O licence.

 

You won't be able to hire one without proof of holding an O licence.

 

Im afraid that the only way you will be able to own and run a 7.5 is with an O licence and paying the pointless £8000 to sit in the bank.

 

You'll also need to pay a transport manager to manage your entire fleet of one vehicle.

 

Save yourself money, get a company to do it!

[slim_mcslim]

this is not strictly true... it all depends on how the trafic commissioner in your part of the world works...

 

you used to be able to apply for an O licence for hired in vehicles only, on the form you just have to list a fantasy vehicle or two, and state on the form it is to covered hired in vehicles only, and they used to grant O licences on this basis, our first operators licence was like this to cover hiring two 7.5t trucks

 

I am not sure how this stands with the modern need for a transport manager with a CPC. We have had an O licence for 4 years and have only been visited by VOSA once.

[cfmonk]

Welcome to my world!

 

You DO need an operators licence but you can apply for one where you will only be using hired in vehicles. If the funds issue is still a problem (which I don't think it would continue to be) then approach you bank manager, explain the situation and ask them for a letter saying they would give you an overdraft to cover the money needed. This is what we have done and has got us nicely around actually having to have the money sitting around.

 

Dodge: You DO NOT need a fleet manager on a restricted operators licence. Mine quite clearly states "None" in that box.

 

Chris

[dwents]

Welcome to my world!

 

You DO need an operators licence but you can apply for one where you will only be using hired in vehicles. If the funds issue is still a problem (which I don't think it would continue to be) then approach you bank manager, explain the situation and ask them for a letter saying they would give you an overdraft to cover the money needed. This is what we have done and has got us nicely around actually having to have the money sitting around.

 

Dodge: You DO NOT need a fleet manager on a restricted operators licence. Mine quite clearly states "None" in that box.

 

Chris

 

I spoke to Vosa they do a restricted licence which is for one vehicle but still requires £3k in the bank plus all the fees and as long as you dont use vehicle for more than 28 days you can just keep hiring but it allows you to operate your own

seems a bit daft really going to have to do some proper maths on this subject

[Kevin@Wicked]

Its nice that VOSA have allowed you to only have £3k for hired vehicles, for 2 vehicles (1 owned & 1 hire) I had to demonstrate £12600! - You need to think long about the whole process - I sent my application for my O Licence in March and took 9 weeks to complete. You need to have an operating centre even if you dont own a vehicle which needs to be advertised in your commercial newspaper at around £250+vat followed by the £250 non refundable application fee, then £391 licence fee once accepted.

 

Where are you based dwents if you dont mind me asking? We have done a number of jobs for marquee companies recently using tautliners and flats.

[Stuart91]

My question is I run a Marquee company and require a 7.5 ton truck

 

any advice is very welcome

 

My advice would be to consider whether you actually NEED a 7 tonner. If payload is the issue, most 7 tonners have around 3 ton capacity. This is only a little over what you can carry in two Sprinter sized vans. Plus a Sprinter or Transit is more useful as a "day to day" vehicle when you don't have a job on - it's a bit tricky popping down to B&Q in a 7 ton truck.

 

Then, if you land a really big job, the option to hire in a haulage company still exists, and would probably work out less expensive (overall) than the ongoing costs of operating yourself.

 

Of course, I know very little about the marquee trade so your requirements may be very different from a typical PA/Lighting/AV concern. But all the same, I'd be looking very carefully at the comparison of costs.

[Andrew C]

My question is I run a Marquee company and require a 7.5 ton truck my licence allows me to drive it?

Just to pick up on this point; is that a question? Does your (driving) licence allow you to drive it?

 

Mine does allow me to drive 7.5T, but not for hire or reward. That means I can hire one to move house, but NOT to move stuff for work.

[Stuart91]

Mine does allow me to drive 7.5T, but not for hire or reward. That means I can hire one to move house, but NOT to move stuff for work.

 

Are you sure that the "hire or reward" prohibits all kinds of work-related driving? My understanding, not that I've had to rely on it, is that carriage of your own goods is covered, but acting as a haulier or courier isn't.

[Andrew C]

Probably needs checking. In my case it would be my employers goods, possibly different if they were MY goods.

[cfmonk]

Mine does allow me to drive 7.5T, but not for hire or reward. That means I can hire one to move house, but NOT to move stuff for work.

 

Are you sure that the "hire or reward" prohibits all kinds of work-related driving? My understanding, not that I've had to rely on it, is that carriage of your own goods is covered, but acting as a haulier or courier isn't.

 

 

That is my understanding of "For Hire or Reward". I'm fairly certain that it's correct because my insurance prohibits the use of our vehicles "For Hire or Reward" and if that precluded us from charging for marquees then we would be ever so slightly scuppered!

 

Chris

[woody2]

to get round the money in the bank problem we supplied a letter from the bank and accountant and a service contract with merc. to take care of the 12 week inspections

[Andrew C]

Well, the DVLA page on LGV doesn't help, but the mini-bus page gives a clue.

You may be allowed to drive a minibus if it is not used for hire or reward. Hire or reward generally means any payment in cash or kind made by or on behalf of passengers that gives them right to be carried in a vehicle.

However, as the 'goods' couldn't pay for the journey, it still isn't definitive. Are you being "paid" to carry the goods?

[kerry davies]

Andrew; hire or reward does only refer to minibus and not to 7.5 tonners, whether you are being paid to drive one or not. DVLA says I am OK like that until 2018 when I become 70.

Insurance is a totally different matter as they have their own interpretation and may not cover contents used for "hire or reward" under the vehicle policy. That is something for people to take up with their insurers. My car cover does not cover anyone elses kit I happen to have on board but does cover my own tools, PA, projector etc.

 

Stuart; When carrying a 12m span marquee a van is not much use as even the jumbo wheelbases are too short for the ali profile in most cases. Most marquee companys transport high volume, low weight stuff like chairs as well. Hence the need for trucks, space not weight.

 

FYI some stats. There are less operator licences nowadays, down to about 90,000. As the numbers have reduced the opposite has happened to revocations (etc.) of licence. Nearly a thousand cases brought in 2008/09 resulted in only 76 having no action taken so the "guilty" rate has gone up significantly. Those are just the ones they have caught and it says a lot about the poor state of the truck sector, is it any wonder that the regs keep getting tighter?