walked out in middle of gig, master faders down.

[cliff]

hi,

 

I am a freelance live engineer working in london. This evening I was working in house for a venue in notting hill.

 

The venue is vv small, 220 capacity. The pa I was using consists of two yamaha self powered speakers :blink: , and two monitor sends to three little wedges. The desk is a mix wizard with an xta eq on the outputs, m1 fx, drawmer gates and comps. etc etc so you get the idea

 

So its pretty small and hard to make anything sound half decent. As I am sure you are all aware, most of the sound is from the backline, so your job is trying to get the vocals above the backline and send them to the wedges. I do mic the gits and the bass and kick drum. So you have an idea of what the gig is like. A nightmare, just do it for a bit of easy dosh.

 

Anyway. headline band, three songs in,. The lead singer is complaining that he cant hear himself, so I send more the the wedges. Then he starts to get really anoyed and asking for more and more. At this point the monitor amp (which is under the foh desk) is clipping. I tell the band manager standing by my side that thats it, no more left.

 

The band stop and start chuntering around on their instruments. They start getting angry. The following comments were shouted down the microphone:

 

"come on you must be able to make it louder than this"

 

"what the f--k are you doing"

 

everyone in the audience turns and looks at me

 

"this is f--king rediculous what the hell are you doing"

 

the band manager is standing next to me and starts giving me stick and I explain that there is nothing I can do.

 

more and more stick from the lead singer for about 30 seconds. So this is where the fun began:

 

I pulled down the master faders and left via the nearest fire door into a fire excape corridoor. As im leaving the band manager sounds desperately "come back, come back"

 

luckily a bouncer comes through the fire door first, then the band manager, then the venue managers, then the band.

 

Everyone is going ape as you can imagine, the dj starts back up.

 

I explain that I dont get paid to take abuse.

 

I return to the stage and find that the monitor has been unplugged by perhaps an audience member. I return to the raging band and explain what the problem was.

 

end of show. lots of pis--d off people.

 

 

 

was this totally unreasonable? was I completely unfair doing this? I have never done this before neither have I seen anyone do it. perhaps I was in an intollerable mood?

 

what are you opinions? have you ever done it? did I do the right thing?

 

 

Just needed to ask some other people in the business.

 

Thanks.

 

Cliff.

[cliff]

ps, I did this gig in front of 3 sound guys that I know and work with regularlly, 7 record labels, and Alan Mcgee!!!! :D its Alan Mcgees "Deathdisco" by the way.

 

just got an sms from one saying "maximum respect sir"

 

hmmmm :blink:

[IanG]

was this totally unreasonable?  was I completely unfair doing this?  I have never done this before neither have I seen anyone do it.  perhaps I was in an intollerable mood?

 

what are you opinions?  have you ever done it?  did I do the right thing?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yep - you did the right thing. Nobody in any line of work should have to take that kind of abuse as part of their job. I'd have done the same (although I'd probably have stayed at FOH in order to reduce the chance of getting beaten up outside!).

 

The other way to get out of that situation is to turn to the band manager and say "The monitor amp is clipping. I'll turn it up, but under the terms of your contract you're responsible if it dies". That way it is no longer your problem, and it's the band that suffer the most at the end of the day.

[Brian]

Back in the dim distant past I used to do gigs like that; thankfully I realised that they weren't really 'easy money' and moved on.

 

Should you have to take that abuse - No. A certain type of 'pub' band seems to think it necessary to act a part; to play out the role of how they think successful bands behave.

 

Wrong. It's my general experience that the more professional the band, the nicer they are to work with and the less far up their own a*** they are.

 

My only criticism (I know that sounds a bit harsh but I couldn't think of a less harsh word) of you would be that maybe you should have left the desk whilst the band were playing and gone onto stage to check the monitor level yourself. You could have left the band manager to make sure no-one fiddled with the gear. If the wedge was unplugged at this point (it might have happened later of course) you might have been able to defuse the situation?

[James]

Can I ask? If you do have problems getting the vocals above the level of the backline then why do you mic' the gits and the bass and kick drum?

 

My preference for smaller gigs in rooms like that is to DI the gits and bass so I can controll the stage volume. Yes there is a compramise in sound but I would rather have a compramised balanced sound than uncompramised uneven sound.

 

Saying this I generaly work with bands that will sit and listen to suggestions and advice for working in small rooms.

 

Of course YMMV and given the same set of circumstances I might be tempted to do the same as you did. The last time I had a problem like that was when I had someone from the venue come up to me complaining about the volume I shrugged, threw every single fader down to 0 (the groups were already down) and gestured saying "If you think you can turn them down more than that please be my guest" when he realised that none of the sound was from FOH and it was all stage volume then he stopped harassing me and started harassing the band to turn it down,

 

Good Luck

 

 

James

[cliff]

cool, thanks for your commentas.

 

Just refering to what james just said about getting the vocals up.....

 

Its usually ok. I rearely ever push the faders up on the guitar mics at all. DIing the guitars would be an absolute luxary in this situation but the kind of bands they get in there are the libertines wannabe types. They want "that" sound with their guitars.

 

They turn up with marshal 4x12's and expect to turn them up to 6, not a chance. Its absolutly rediculous.

 

Just to let you knwo im never going to do it again. ever. and you are right, its not easy dosh at all. the smaller the venue, the more hassle it is.

[MikeR]

and you are right, its not easy dosh at all.  the smaller the venue, the more hassle it is.

 

Not completely true, Ive had great fun on small pub gigs, in fact I don't think Id want to do a proper rock n roll show for various reasons. Anyone remember the Lost T shirts of Atlantis? A fine bunch to work with in a pub. I only did it a couple of times though but great fun all the same. Stylophne solos & Hendrix style ukele playing? Fantastic.

 

Have to say , though Ive been close I have never walked off a gig - I would see it as unproffesional. In exactly the way that the bands treatment of you was also unprofessional. Sorry just my tuppence worth.

[Just Some Bloke]

I'm afraid I have to agree with Brian.

 

Indeed, no-one should have to take that type of abuse and you were well within your rights to walk out.

 

However, too many sound engineers listen with their eyes instead of their ears. Looking at a clip LED doesn't tell you if the singer can hear his own voice or not. Listening to his monitor does. This would have alerted you to the fact that the lead had been unplugged and you would have been seen as the savior who sorted out the problem!

 

Hope all future gigs are abuse-free!

 

JSB

[peterkirklive]

im a musician and did the same just the other night, to cut a long story short it started when I was asked mid 1st set to move my car so some one could get out of the car park! sounds petty I know but it got worse when I went out side and got verbally abused as I protested that it wasnt on to stop the show and my car wasnt the problem [as I parked onlt where I could] I should have been asked to leave my keys at reception but some one obvioulsy forgot........I could,nt win that night! I had some old dears one side saying its too loud another woman the other side saying she could ,nt hear............im pouring with sweat feeling very stressed and ill, had enough, finished first set and left. as I said sound petty but had you been there you probably would have done the same, why people think they can have a go at the act for any reason and expect you to carry on is beyond me.........I wish I,d handled it differently obviously , but there ya go, im only human and sure that another contractor/staff member /guest would,nt have been spoken to in that way, my agent has,nt called yet tho...............

I actually hate my my job I used to love some times..........

 

no body should put up with crap like this where ever they work.

[aidso]

Hum yes I think everyone has done a gig like that where they just get hassled. The only time it has ever got bad enough for ME to want to walkout, I cam to the desicsion that the band were playing on my stage and should be respecting me. So I asked the promoter nicely to remove the band from the stage or as it was my P.A. I would be turning it off and leaving. With in a few minuites the band said they were sorry and quitly finished their set.

 

But yeah I know were you are coming from. No we should not have to take abuse when doing our job, do bands have to take abuse?

[fatfrog]

I know where your coming from, I did a gig like that once, No matter what I did I couldn't please the people in charge, In the end I just asked for assistance from a 2nd engineer/friend, We both concluded that the radio mic system was knackered and was the start of my problems, Once we resolved this everything was cool.

 

But yes you do feel pretty crap when people start giving you abuse for something that aint your fault.

 

Alan

[mervaka]

had they not have been so mouthy, I would have also gone to check the stage end of things.. however if they lose their cool I'd first ask them to calm down before I go any further.

[paulears]

Much as I sympathise, Cliff - you're going to be known as 'the bloke who walks out'. People who want you to mix for them will know that you are prepared to stop a gig in mid-flow if this kind of thing happens again. Some will take this as a sign of 'don't mess me about, or else......' while others will tag you as a bolshy devil. Neither from your story are fair comments - but consider this band. Are they telling people how good you were, or how this bloke wrecked the gig? Being right doesn't make people book you.

 

I have been angry, sometimes really angry with the people on stage, and taken abuse quite often. When things go wrong and you try to help to get the "twenty thousand on the dole and we've got a dick-head (or insert far worse word beginning with C - thanks Mr Davidson) on the sound" makes you cross and feel pretty unappreciated, but life sucks sometimes.

 

If you know the band, try to mend your relationship - especially if they could have some of your work with others in their hands.

 

The old saying that you are only as good as your last job is worth repeating. I feel for you, but I'm not sure walking out is a good idea, no matter what the provocation.

[GreatBigHippy]

Been there man. I can see how you might have come to the decision you did.

Mine was a favour for a mate. A group of various live hip-hop and drum and bass acts in a underground nightclub. I had a nightmare as my stage guy pulled at the last minute meaning I had to set everything in ultra-fast speed.

Was going ok until the most talentless MC stepped on his own mic cable! Whilst trying to sort this out I had to put up with some pretty nasty stuff from stage.

Afterwards the club owner said I did an excellent job under the circumstances and that the band would get booked by him or anyone he knows again!

All you can do is the best with what you have. I didn't walk but I felt like it. Fortunately the talented bands on later were much more forgiving of the situation.

Ah well, as Douglas Adams said

"You live, you learn. Well, at any rate, you live"

[Just Some Bloke]

There is a very difficult word to define called "professionalism". For me professionalism includes the fact that if you're booked to do a job then you complete that job no matter what, at the very least for the sake of the punters. It's not their fault the band/comedian/star is an @rseh0le and they've paid their money to be entertained. If you pull the plug and walk out, they suffer - there's a fair chance the band will still get paid as they were happy to finish the gig, so they won't suffer that much at all.

 

I've been known to make a mental note never to work with certain people again, and I've certainly been grumpy in the load-out, but I've never walked out mid-show. I'm afraid it doesn't achieve what you want it to acheive.

 

At the weekend at my venue there was a show that went wrong. Certain pieces of music which should have been played didn't get played. Our technician took the full force of the compere's anger in front of a full audience. He carried on and finished the gig. Now, it turns out that the fault was in fact that of the compere who had given the wrong track number on one occasion (and not named the tracks on the Mini Disc) then not given a CD at all on the other occasion. But our technician was totally professional, took the slagging off without saying a word, tried to sort it out after the event and then briefed me the next day so I could fight his corner. That is entirely the right thing to do. Had he given as good as he got at the time, I would have had a huge problem on my hands which could easily have ended up with him losing his job. Bear in mind that none of the problems were his fault - he is, in fact, an excellent technician.

 

Much as I can understand the feeling that "I don't need to take this", I would always recomend changing the thought to "I don't intend ever to work with these t0ssers again"