Control room sound

[dave1022]

To my shock, surprise and bewilderment my school has decided to put a window across the part of the balcony in school where sound and lighting are controled from. This wouldn't make the room soundproof, but it will certainly block out most of the sound that we otherwise hear from the hall.

 

So, I'm posting to ask what people would recommend for a permanent set of monitors in the control room, and a permanent stet of mics in the hall and/or on the stage.

 

• What microphones would you suggest to be permanently installed?
  
• How many, and where should the mics go?
  
• What monitor speakers would you recommend?
  
• Would it be fine to run the mics through an auxiliary output on the main sound desk, or would it be better to get a seperate small mixer?
  

 

Regards,

David

[paulears]

Sadly, Dave - it matters not what you put in really, because whatever it sounds like in there, it won't sound like it outside. There are plenty of decent nearfield monitors about, but the real solution is to not do it - although no doubt it's a done deal. To be very honest, if you're a student, I'd keep well out of it because when it works really badly, you want a member of staff's name on the project, not yours. If you get involved then when it goes t*ts up as it will for so many reasons detailed in other topics about this subject, you will be blamed when the teachers or staff are looking for a scapegoat for such a daft thing.

[GreatBigHippy]

There really should be a support group for engineers who have to put up with this sort of thing.... Happened to me too.

Put any sort of monitors in there, doesn't matter. Use them only for show time for hearing cue lines, don't expect to get any sense of what the audience are hearing.

If sound is important to the show, desk goes in the auditorium.

And for good measure - :) :wall:

[dave1022]

Whether it's too late or not I don't know, but would it be worth seeing if part of the window could be an opening window?

 

A concurrent post has been automatically merged from this point on.

 

If the glass window is going ahead, I've plumped for a pair of Behringer 1C-BK speakers rated at 100W each for monitors. Only trouble is I can't find an amp below 200W to power them. Any ideas?

[elvenprince]

Is there no way of asking the school if they can put it on sliders so you can open one side?

[J Pearce]

I suspect it'll be belt and braces firewalling causing the issue. School builders like to make every door a fire door, and so to have a room (especially full of electrical equipment) that isn't firewalled is entirely absurd to them.

 

There may even be the issue of someone at somepoint having been silly enough to mention the magic words 'projection room' which means mega firewalling due to a standard based on old arc and xenon lamped cine projectors.

[dave1022]

Is there no way of asking the school if they can put it on sliders so you can open one side?

 

I'm sure I can ask, whether they'll listen or not is a different matter.

[CharlieH]

Is there no way of asking the school if they can put it on sliders so you can open one side?

 

I don't even pretend to be anywhere near an expert on this subject, but surely a sliding window would still mess with the acoustics of what you're hearing? :unsure:

[Blaize110]

We used to have a sliding window between our control room and the hall meaning that only 1/3 of it would open. Made it really hard to hear and as people have already said, monitors are no substitute. Depending on the arrangement a sliding one may only be able to open half of the space because the window needs somewhere to slide to. The school has since got a set of hinged opening windows that have dramatically improved the situation. You just need to have the space to open them into.

 

Admittedly it isn't perfect as there is still a wall in the way but it is fine for everyday things and then for the larger shows (once or twice a year) we usually move the sound desk outside to somewhere in the hall or on the balcony depending on the cabling requirements.

[Bryson]

Removable sliding windows are entirely possible. I've had them installed in a venue before.

[WiLL]

Is there no leeway in just explaining to the building manager why a window would be a bad idea? Don't forget that people outside of theatre have little or no experience of it's requirements, mistakes aren't made maliciously, but simply because they didn't know any better. I recently had to explain why I wanted my studio space black during a refurbishment, and why the house lights needed to be dimmable.

.. and no, monitors for the sound op is about as much use as a condom machine in the vatican. If they can't experience the same sound as the audience, they can't do their job properly. If what they hear is coming via a secondary source, how can they tell if the level is too loud in reality or just that their monitors are up too high?

[dave1022]

Trouble is they've already got the windows and they're ready to put them in. I have thought up one positive though; we'll actually be able to speak to each other in the control room during productions. And I presume that the monitors could be calibrated to a certain degree of accuracy, though nowhere near what it would usually sound like.

 

And don't even get me started on house lights... The ones we have in school aren't dimmable and they make horrible noises whenever they're turned on, and they take about five minutes to all get fully on. And we don't even have switches in the control room so somone has to take a walkie talkie downstairs to turn them off... :unsure: :wacko:

[TomHoward]

One of our outlying venues has the house lighting problem, and when we put events in there we just re-light it with four high-powered fresnels in the corners, firing up into the (luckily white) ceiling. Bit low level but works effectively enough for house lighting.

[elvenprince]

Is there no way of asking the school if they can put it on sliders so you can open one side?

 

I don't even pretend to be anywhere near an expert on this subject, but surely a sliding window would still mess with the acoustics of what you're hearing? :P

 

 

True, but they're better than trying to hear through glass.

[Geminius]

One of our outlying venues has the house lighting problem, and when we put events in there we just re-light it with four high-powered fresnels in the corners, firing up into the (luckily white) ceiling. Bit low level but works effectively enough for house lighting.

 

 

Yep we do that at my school too but uses an old minuet CCT works a treat, also useful when the director wants some of the cast to go into the audience.