willsonj Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Hi What size and type of cable would be required to run a 100V line system for a distance of about 1000m? There would be about 6x 30w horns at various points along the run. I would be very greatful if anyone is able to help! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chappie Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 This may be useful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Lewis Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 And this site provides a useful conversion from AWG to the nearest mm^2 CSA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 6 horns along a kilometer in length? That's a long way for a few loudspeakers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakeedokee Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 I used 1.5mm multi-core at Southend air show and had to re-amplify at approximately 750m. Had I used 2.5mm I wouldn't have had any significant loss over the 1.5km total length of that particular leg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willsonj Posted July 25, 2009 Author Share Posted July 25, 2009 And this site provides a useful conversion from AWG to the nearest mm^2 CSA Thanks for that. Using the calculator tool on that link, if I used 0.75mm cable it is telling me there would be a loss of -2.28 dB. If I used 2.5mm cable then it is telling me there would be a loss of -1.05 dB. To me there doesn't seem to be a that much of a difference in dB loss between the 0.75mm cable and the 2.5mm cable. Am I right in thinking this? Or would it make a noticable difference to the output of the horns? Obviously there is quite a difference in cost between 0.75mm and 2.5mm over that distance! A concurrent post has been automatically merged from this point on. 6 horns along a kilometer in length? That's a long way for a few loudspeakers? It is not to provide full coverage over the whole run, just horns at various positions along it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 Have a look on your mixer and see what having to put the level up by a one dB to cover the increased cable losses looks like. And the number the calculator gives is wrong anyway, because you aren't sending 180W for a distance of 1000m; as the speakers are tapped along the line you are only sending 180W for the first section of the line, betwixt amp and first horn. The section from the first horn to the second horn is down to 150W etc, you get the idea. So if the losses are low enough with 0.75mm for the first hop, the losses wil be lower for the last hop. Look around for cabling; 1mm or 1.5mm lawn mower cable (in fetching orange) is often available more cheaply than proper cable on the roll. My ongoing problem with 100V is what connectors to use. I've pretty much settled on Jones connectors (made by Cinch) as I want three or four core cable (100V line plus local level override relay signal), and dont want anything that can be confused with other cables. Trouble is the Jones connectors aren't of the mechanical and environmental standards I would like... If only Cannon hadn't discontinued the speaker XLR... One local company round our way that does most of the big outdoor shows uses standard mains extension cables for the 100V lines, miles of the stuff. Cant say it isn't easy (our plugs stack so no need for any sort of twofer), but it would be unfortunate if mains were to get into the 100V line... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mksound Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 Hi What size and type of cable would be required to run a 100V line system for a distance of about 1000m? There would be about 6x 30w horns at various points along the run. I would be very greatful if anyone is able to help!2 x 2.5mm cable would be the best option in this case. Make sure you use flexible cable, you would be amazed how many amature set ups I've seen with T&E being used. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 I'm old enough to remember the two separate cored twisted feeder and you could tap in by soldering a couple of safety pins to each column or horn tail, and then pinning through the insulation a couple of inches apart. If it looked like rain, you even used tape! With a bit of care and a soldering iron, it was quite easy to remove the pins, 'blob' the holes with the iron, and then use it again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomHoward Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 My ongoing problem with 100V is what connectors to use. I've pretty much settled on Jones connectors (made by Cinch) as I want three or four core cable (100V line plus local level override relay signal), and dont want anything that can be confused with other cables. Trouble is the Jones connectors aren't of the mechanical and environmental standards I would like... If only Cannon hadn't discontinued the speaker XLR...I'm not recommending this, but I have seen a hire company that run their 100V line horns on 110V Yellow Ceeforms, like you would see on a building site - so large gauge cables are readily available and can be hired cheaply as needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emsgeorge Posted July 27, 2009 Share Posted July 27, 2009 Ive seen horns mostly on XLR's - or as mentioned before, those 2 pin cannon connectors that look a little like XLR's. I saw one a couple of weeks ago, with black 2.5mm, and with low voltage ceeforms (purple ones), but 2 pin models. Was rugged and seemed quite water resistant, and looked quite neat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willsonj Posted July 30, 2009 Author Share Posted July 30, 2009 Thanks for all of that. I take it the cable can be single insulated? Just straying slightly away from the topic a bit now, but has anyone ever used one of these ? Are they as good as a 100V line amplifier? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Many 100V amplifers are no more than low impedence amplifiers with a 100V matching transformer in the same box. Some amps (eg Cloud) offer the transformers as an option if you want 100V output instead of low impedence. However if you smoke a standard amp and you declare you were driving a transformer then you may get some wiggle on warranty claims. Its only once the power levels get up that a transformer is not necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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