Headphones that mirror good monitors

[The Boogie Man]

Hi troops, I was wondering, does anyone have any recomendations, for headphones that they would be happy to use instead of studio monitors? I was reading a review today about a pair of ultrasone edition 8 which the reviewer said he would trust to mix on and know they were as good as his moitors. At over a grand though, well beyond my budget. But this got me thinking Is there any other cans that could be purchased intead of studio mons.

 

Just a thought.

 

cheers

Baz

[johndenim]

Hi Baz, where have you been?!

 

I came across this the other day funnily enough.

 

It might prove an interesting read?

[ChazHS]

Sennheiser HD-25MK2s, perfect as a replacement for studio monitors.

[fatfrog]

I've always found the AKG K-271's good headphones for studio work. It always seems to give me a true representation of what I'm working on.

 

Beyer Dynamic DT-100's are also another option. They are used widely in studio's throughout the world

[Sound Juice]

The Beyer 700 series are very good aswell, and cost around the £179 mark wich isn't horrific as headphones go

[MarkPAman]

I've got a pair of Roland RH-300s which I won at a trade show! ;) :D

 

I've not had them long, but so far, the recordings I've done using them have sounded good in the studio too.

[sticks]

If you are looking for headphones that mirror good monitors my personal recommendation would be the Sennheiser HD600s, although the HD650s are also very popular.

 

An open back design is much more suitable for mixing as you don't get as bad ear fatigue so can wear the headphones for much longer, also the high end open back designs (to my ears) often have improved HF definition. If you are mixing on headphones because you are in a noisy environment or are really worried about headphone spill then I'd agree the DT770's might be worth a listen as a closed back alternative

 

Headphones such as the DT100's are used widely in studios but are designed for musician monitoring, they aren't ideal to mix on and I think you'd be disappointed with the results. I have a pair of DT100's that I use for live work, or if I am recording someone who needs to wear headphones but would never use them for critical listening, that it where my HD600's really shine.

 

The best thing you could do, is take some music you know really well into a shop and have a listen to as many headphones as you can, and match them to the sound of the monitors that you know. Remember with mixing you are often interested in headphones that are truthful rather than sound nice. For example a low bit rate mpeg file may well sound nicer on cheap headphones rather than on a set with extended hf response where you may hear the mpeg compression. That said if a mix sounds nice on a pair of high quality headphones, it is almost certain to translate well to lower quality systems.

[stagemanagement]

Ecler have recently released a new design of headphone with an offset driver to simulate the arrival of sound at a more natural angle; I have only tried them a couple of times, but they were very accurate in terms of response and it was noticably more reminiscent of listening to speakers from in front, rather than headphones from the sides.

 

They are just over £100

 

http://www.juno.co.uk/products/337811-01.h...ogle%2BShopping

 

 

Apart from that, I would agree on the Sennheiser HD600/650 recommendation - excellent reference headphones.

I own and still use a pair of the HD500's which were the old model and they are without a doubt the most comfortable and sweet sounding headphones I've ever bought for reference work.

[The Boogie Man]

cheers for the input, troops.

 

I'll look into the models recomended so far.

 

At the moment I have sennheiser eh2270 and eh1430 anyone know where they sit in the food chain?

the hd600, big step up in quality from mine?

 

Has anyone got any real world experience with the ultrasone 900, they sound very good in review and are £350. The senheiser hd600 are 230 at thomman. worth the extra?

 

chers

Baz

 

(Hi john, yes I'm still alive. I've just not been in for a while ;) )

[paulears]

A couple of observations. DT100s (and as the owner of plenty of these, I feel I can comment) are rubbish in terms of sonic quality. They are brilliant for being able to handle very loud inputs, they are tough, they are reliable and long lasting - they keep out unwanted sound, and stop the headphone audio leaking out. They sound sort of ...... dull. DT-150s are a bit better, but nowhere near as good as some of the open style ones, and I have to say that Sennheiser seem to be the most truthful.

 

There is one very important element of headphone monitoring for mixing missing here. Stereo field. There is no way at all of doing this properly without real speakers. Loudspeakers, one left and right impact on both ears. They don't on headphones. Image stability, depth and spacial location requires loudspeakers. Equally, you can create amazing effects in headphones that fail miserably on speakers. Stereo is all to do with amplitude and time, and although binaural recording is an effective recording system, and can be used with amazing results, it needs isolation between ears to wor properly.

 

You need both. Speakers to mix on and headphones to check. In fact, mixing on headphones can often make you feel quite sick. Try listening to early stereo Beatles, or old stereo recordings of big band music. The production style and the 'newness' of stereo meant that very often the concept of stereo became a quest to have isolation between channels. On speakers it's not too bad, but on headphones, simply disturbing.

 

Probably worth noting that when Music Technology first became an examination subject, examiners were instructed to always use loudspeakers, and headphone marking was banned - because lots of marks came from effective use of the stereo field, and the decision was made that this is impossible on headphones.

[TomHoward]

I was going to mirror what Paul says - it would be true to say that while working on headphones has it's place (working late at night in a block of flats for example), I don't think I would mix exclusively on headphones due to the issues with the stereo field.

 

Personally my primary pair of headphones are the Sennheiser HD280s - although my use is more critical monitoring in a live situation than studio / home studio mixing.

 

I used to have the HD25s, and when I had them lost for me (leant them to a colleague) I decided to change because I never found the HD25s that comfortable for prolonged use.

 

I would also echo the comments about DT100s - I've used them extensively as foldback for tracking in recording studios and I never found them to be that great, especially in terms of sound output / sensitivity - and in a live situation I've found it hard to hear them over the room compared to my HD280s. We have a pair of DT150s at work for use in a live situation and personally (although better than the DT100s) I still use my HD280s over them there as well.

[Killyp]

I've never been able to judge a mix properly on headphones. Not only is there a lack of correct correct stereo imaging and depth with headphones (unless we're talking about binaural recordings), but I've always found it incredibly difficult to judge dynamics properly with the complete and utter lack of the room reflections you get from speakers and a control room (even in the best studios).

 

Nothing can be used to substitute a good pair of monitors and good acoustics. If most of the studios could replace their often incredibly expensive monitors and room treatment with a simple pair of £2k headphones, then they would've done it years ago.

[daveh]

Forget it!

Further to Pauls comments, in 30 years of mixing all manner of material in many studios, I've never found a practical use for cans during the mix process.

As an exercise, spend some time doing a mixdown using good cans, then run the mix through decent monitors.....

All will become self evident.

Dave

[jamesperrett]

I would also echo Paul and Dave's comments. Headphones tend to allow you to focus too far into a mix and make it difficult to keep perspective. This is fine if you intend your mixes to be listened to only on headphones but it is easy to miss an imbalance in the mix on headphones that would be obvious on speakers. However, you can often achieve a fair bit of mix preparation on headphones and they are good for checking on panning (though earlier comments about the stereo field are also valid) so I'd recommend a combination of mixing on headphones and mixing on monitors.

 

Cheers

 

James.

[stagemanagement]

It may be interesting to consider that more than half of todays music consumers are listening PRIMARILY on headphones..............horribly tinny, uncomfortable, white ones! :** laughs out loud **: