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Hippotizer Operation issue


dunk

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Evening All,

 

For the Hippotizer Ops out there////

 

I have been on a rig and spent all evening "programming" our Hippo HD with the client. I am essentially using our Hippo as a glorified vision mixer, dual outputting with multiple picture in pictures, with nice global animated background, effects on their logos, etc. It all looks very nice....

However, I am controlling it all via my Pearl Expert and it is a pain in the ass to have to adjust every layer and adjust every aspect of all the effects, not to mention trudging through the Pearl's menu system to get the look I want. It is difficult when the client wants to see different options immediately.

It is far, far easier to do it locally on zookeeper and get immediate results using the mouse any keyboard. Being that I cant "send" DMX changes to the Avo lighting desk, I am saving Global presets to get the looks the clients wants, immediately. Its all good and well having them saved, but it is useless in a show situation when I need to have the states accessible from the LX desk. (It has taken me 4 hours to recreate all of the VT states via the LX desk this evening! - I am sure those of you know what you are doing with the Hippo probably think I am an idiot and know a way to do it in 5 mins!)

 

Is there any way to have control over the presets via MIDI/DMX? (Reason why I ask about MIDI is that if there is, I will buy a midi controlled if DMX is out of the question.)

 

Thanks

 

 

Duncan

 

(ps, Nic, as I know you will read this, can you kick AVO' up the ass and get them to impliment the necessary RDS DMX comms that allow 2 way talk from the hippo to the pearl - thus refreshing changes made from either end. Hippo have already implemented it, it is just the Console guys who need to keep up! Thanks Dude.)

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Funny you should ask this question. I'm currently sat in front of a Magic Q wondering the exact same thing (that and how to get the tumbnails working on the desk.

Perhaps this is evidence of the evolution of digital lighting!

 

Anyhow, regarding the thumbnails on the MagicQ, have you got Hmap2 installed and running as a component on the engine? Have you connected the 2 via artnet?

 

look here for a white doc on MagicQ and Hippotizers: http://www.chamsys.be/download/manuals/magicqhippo.pdf?dl=44

 

HTH

 

Dunc

 

ps, let me know how you succeed with the preset issue, and I will do the same.

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Dunk,

Hi mate. I haven't used v3 much, but can't you put a preset on a timeline and then trigger that from the console?

Leggy.

 

Hey Leggy, long time no speak!

 

Come to think of it, I believe you are right...Although, I havent ever used time lines before! If this is the case, that this is the way to do it, I will get my self off to HippoSchool and learn what I need to know. Can anyone confirm this?

 

Hope you are well, and speak soon.

 

 

Dunc

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Understood. I'm sure is already in development but I will highlight it again for you.

Similarly, finding attributes on high channel-count fixtures like this is a nightmare, especially if it uses more than one patch and it is important there is a solution.

 

But for now I have a random idea. For programming with the client, how about creating a mode2 playback for some (or all!) attributes and then use record stage? Obviously using faders, especially the 60mm ones might not be accurate for everything and having all attributes may well be too confusing. But a combination of placing some attributes on faders, perhaps some common options on palettes and the remainder from attributes might help. Remember that you can select attribute by its name via softkeys (press the old attribute bank button) and this menu can be latched.

 

 

Someone needs to sort me a hippo for testing...

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Understood. I'm sure is already in development but I will highlight it again for you.

Similarly, finding attributes on high channel-count fixtures like this is a nightmare, especially if it uses more than one patch and it is important there is a solution.

 

But for now I have a random idea. For programming with the client, how about creating a mode2 playback for some (or all!) attributes and then use record stage? Obviously using faders, especially the 60mm ones might not be accurate for everything and having all attributes may well be too confusing. But a combination of placing some attributes on faders, perhaps some common options on palettes and the remainder from attributes might help. Remember that you can select attribute by its name via softkeys (press the old attribute bank button) and this menu can be latched.

 

 

Someone needs to sort me a hippo for testing...

Hey Nic,

Glad to see you are on top form, no matter what time or day! I understand what you are saying but the issue is that when one is working with 6 or so layers and every layer has some sort of effect running, (mainly soft edge blending to blend logos into backgrounds, etc) and every state may have a different logo in a different position, it will get very clunky, very quickly. I have been utilising the pallets as much as possible for positions, etc, but in the show I am in as we speak, I have given up on trying to get it beautifully slick and I am running it locally, carefully juggling what master layer faders are up on the Pearl at any one time. Thankfully it all work and looked amazing. The attributes via softkeys is a godsend!

 

I am happy for you to take our HD after next week. It isnt out till August after that. Let me know if this is of any use!

 

Thanks again and much respect,

 

Dunc

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Here to serve. Post load-out web-cruise and drink. Performance drops off rapidly...

 

This would be a good thread to gather information on how you would like it to work and how other consoles manage it. Perhaps custom arrangement of attributes/placement on softkeys. Maybe some way of shortcutting - a bit like groups but with attributes?

 

Or do you think it generally better to work on the Hippo and just send the info back?

 

PS. The Hippo suggestion wasn't entirely serious, but I do appreciate the offer. I'll talk with Avo about development position and give you a shout if it is genuinely useful.

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Here to serve. Post load-out web-cruise and drink. Performance drops off rapidly...

 

This would be a good thread to gather information on how you would like it to work and how other consoles manage it. Perhaps custom arrangement of attributes/placement on softkeys. Maybe some way of shortcutting - a bit like groups but with attributes?

 

Or do you think it generally better to work on the Hippo and just send the info back?

 

PS. The Hippo suggestion wasn't entirely serious, but I do appreciate the offer. I'll talk with Avo about development position and give you a shout if it is genuinely useful.

 

Cool... Well the offer stands. You do enough for the rest of us, I will happily loan it to you!

 

Anyhow, I am certain, in retrospect, I am not entirely using the hippo what it was designed for. However, I did a job not so along ago which involved multiple layers of wizardry, award stings, etc, and sent it every work related person I know and more and more interest has been coming forward. (go to www.dclx.co.uk and check out the "Hipptozer VT" bit at the bottom left to see what I seem to be doing on a daily basis.

 

Essentially, with every corporate event, those of us who are board ops will know that it is good to have a decent LX state per award, then have it bust into life for the "and the winner is" sting. What seems to be happening is that I am using the hippo as part of my lighting rig and projecting nice slow moving graphics with various layers with live camera, logos, etc and having a different state for every lx award state. As I said before, it takes FOREVER doing it manually and bit by bit on the pearl when it can be done in seconds locally on the hippo, which is unhelpful.

 

I have worked around it slightly by having several template states with sizings and positions stored on a a few palletes and then I just select a relevent layer and appy a pre saved (on a pallet) media clip onto a position pallette. This is workable but takes 100 times longer than doing it on the locally on the opitomizer.

 

Does this roughly give you an idea of how I am trying to work with it?

 

I will admit, however, that I am not fluent in the language of the Hippotizer and I will be getting myself onto HippoSchool. I do know, however, that with problems like this arising can only be a good thing as it will encourage board manufactures to develop their consoles to suit the requirements. As they say, a problem is there to be solved!

 

Thanks

 

Dunc

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I roughly understand what you are needing to do and why it is difficult. I was more interested in whether there was anything in particular you wish the console did to help. ie. is there anything along the lines of how attributes are selected for editing and applying the edit that would make this easier?
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Someone needs to sort me a hippo for testing...

 

You can borrow my critter for a while if you like, I'm only down the road. As long as you don't mind waiting a couple of weeks, call it returning the favor for the pearl training you gave me.

 

Oh and Dunk,

 

I finally got the thumbnails working, I'd forgotten to set the version number iin the media setting window. That's the only thing I don't like about using the Magic Q with a media server, there's too many settings to er... set before you can get it all working correctly. Having said that, once it is working it's so useful.

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Anyhow, I am certain, in retrospect, I am not entirely using the hippo what it was designed for........

Dunc

 

Hi all, we've been a bit tardy on this one and Google alerts only just let me know about the thread so apologies about the late arrival.

 

Let's get one thing straight: In the office they call me the Prince Of Darkness....because darkness I what you get if you put me in front of a console. I'm a vidiot unlike some others on the GH team. So I'm only going to tackle one or two of the issues before I hand it over to an egghead.

 

First of all I don't think your using the Hippotizer for something it wasn't designed to do. In fact more and more are moving servers to the heart rather than on the periphery so using it with mixer-like functionality shouldn't be a problem. Leggy is correct (Hello mate!) in that timelines might be your friend. If you create then load up a timeline or preset with all your looks and layers intact, you can simply patch the controls you need to the relevant faders and functions to stop you 'clunking' around on your desk. Like loading a 'scene' then cross fading or advancing through it as you wish. You might want automated fades (done on the timeline) or you can take control of the fades via your console. How you do this and how you patch the desk depends on what you're doing and we can't see that in a forum so I ain't going to be much help there! I'm going to flag this thread up to someone from the office who can have better input on this but HippoSchool is a dead cert for you if you want to repeat this in the future. We are implementing HippoSchool advanced too which gives more depth to timeline functionallity as more and more people are begining to use them.

 

Regarding Midi control, the Behringer BCF2000 is a worthwhile investment if you want to seperate this all from your console. I'm actually sales and marketing (yes OK, stop throwing tomotoes and eggs please) but even I have used the BCF 2000 armed with just the manual and the right drivers and it's available now for under £200.00. A useful bit of kit. But if you have a console to hand and you know what you're doing you can easily do what you would do on the MIDI device with just a few channels of the desk so don't go spending until you've had it shown to you.

 

I'm assuming you aren't with the client anymore but if you want to expand your skills but specifically with your desk can I suggest HippoSchool to learn the concept then you can stay in the room for as long as you like the day after to apply what you have to your console (assuming you can bring it with you). We now have space specifically for you guys to play so it shouldn't be a problem.

 

And finally, the Hmap2 implementation for the thumbnails plus the software plugin for control via the AVO desk etc will probably be a combination of the theories put forward here. It may be possible to nail it down with a combination of tech support from Green Hippo and/or your chosen desk manufacturer. But it is also true that we have to advance the servers at lightning speed such is the nature of this wonderful realtime video world we inhabit so it might be that you won't find a definitive solution. Once again expect someone who knows to arrive soon. But we are currently talking to manufacturers (including ones mentioned here) about how we can help them keep up. It's a genuine issue since we release updates faster than they do. Not a criticism, just the difference betwen the two disciplines.

 

You need less flannel from me and more input from someone who knows the answers so expect someone along soon.

 

Cheers

 

James

 

 

A concurrent post has been automatically merged from this point on.

 

And Dunk,

After posting the above I took the time to look at the video and your site and thats impressive stuff! I nearly bought me a missile :-) PM me if you want a folder zipped up with all our logos etc in it so you can brand it up where necessary. I'm so happy to see people using Hippotizer in this market as it was my industry before we started Green Hippo. Keep it up and shout if you need us.

 

James

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Dunk,

Hi mate. I haven't used v3 much, but can't you put a preset on a timeline and then trigger that from the console?

Leggy.

 

 

 

Yeah that is the way I would do it too, it's not too painful to crunch through, makes life easier when using a Pearl!

 

Leggy, I believe I know your misses!

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Hi Dunc,

 

Hopefully you got my reply from the forum today, but in short:

 

At the moment the best way to do what you want to do is to drop your presets into either a long single timeline with stop commands in it, or into seperate individual timelines.

 

These can then be easily triggered by DMX from a console, or a midi controller if you prefer.

 

The ability to load presets directly from DMX has been requested and we are working on doing that at the moment, so keep an eye on the new features list at the next software update.

 

If you need any help with the timelines just let me know, but there is no better way of learning them than doing the Hipposchool !

 

Best,

 

nigel Sadler.

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Hey All,

 

Thanks for your comments. I am very keen to get myself on Hippo School as I am doing failry large conference based shows with the hippo and I have never used the timeline. I think its time to kick it up a notch! I am going to bring along our expert and try to manipulate it in the way I need it to work.

I am very excited about the convergence of this whole digital lighting/new age video production/funky shizzle era that the industry seems to be evolving towards. I just know that the Hippo will be at the frontline and I am glad I own one! My clients cant seem to get enough!

 

Anyhow, thanks again, and James/Nigel, I will be in touch!

 

 

Dunc

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