Needing some moral support

[mcdh]

Hi all,

 

Im having a long running battle with my technical manager over what desk to have in our main theatre.

Our theatre is a busy city centre venue, the main theatre seats 220, and does a mixture of in house productions and visiting companies/festivals. We have 2 sound desks for the space, we have an Allen & Heath 2200 24 channel and a Soundcraft Live 4/2 16 Channel. The Soundcraft used to be the permanent desk in the space. Then a few years ago we got the Allen & Heath, it was mainly bought for live music. The idea being we used it as and when required, but panto and other large shows required it to be used more often as the main desk. So for the past couple of years it has been our main desk and it has been great and works very well for what we need. It makes our sound installation in the venue far easier to manage, and a lot less re-plugging of the desk.

 

The long running argument with my boss is about the fact he wants the Soundcraft Live back in the main space. This doesn't make any sense to me nor to any of the other tech's resident or touring. His argument is that the Allen & Heath is not a standard desk and it is intimidating for visiting companies. I have toured and know that it is what I would call a standard desk. If not actually a little below where our venue should probably be, especially as more venues are using digital desks.

 

It would be great to see if anyone else agrees with me, as I am fed up of this on going argument. It would also be good to see what other desks are deemed as standard, or if there is such a thing.

 

Any help would be appreciated and may save my sanity,

 

Cheers

 

mcdh

[Rob_Beech]

The GL2200 is as close to an "industry standard" in a sense as you're going to get. There are more of these desks around than most other models. Everyone has owned or hired or at least used one at some point.

 

The Live 4/2 whilst a good desk in its own right, is not the same in that sense. It doesn't sound any better or any worse. The pre's and eq do give it a unique sound as with the GL2200. Neither is a better or worse desk for sound.

 

The GL2200 is a larger desk, if this desk is used more and more often then you'd be a fool to put the other back in.

[Bobbsy]

Rob sums up the comparison of the two desks very well. There's certainly nothing unusual or intimidating about a 24 channel GL2200 (and I speak as a former Soundcraft 4-2 24 owner).

 

The only other comment I'd make is that 24 channels is far from excessive or unusual even in small venues in this day and age. I'd see no reason to keep switching the desks and, as an argument to throw at your boss, both will probably last longer if they're not constantly bumped in and out.

 

Bob

[Rob_Beech]

I have owned both aswell to clarify. Though the 2200 was a 16 channel and the Live 4 2 a 32 channel.

[StevieR]

Both good desks and both suitable for the role. Personally I would say that the additional inputs offered by the A&H make this the better choice.

 

If your boss is keen to make the desk more of a 'current standard' then perhaps suggest a new desk such as a Soundcraft GB4, Venice 320 or even an LS9.

 

Steve

[themadhippy]

He is the boss ,so wot he says goes.of course the desk "may" develope a fault or get "accidently "damaged at some point.

His argument is that the Allen & Heath is not a standard desk and it is intimidating for visiting companies

WALOB

[Gareth Owen]

He is the boss ,so wot he says goes.of course the desk "may" develope a fault or get "accidently "damaged at some point.

Good plan Mad Hippy.

 

I'm sitting in a pub with a dozen sound engineers and they all agree they would be perfectly happy using either console but would prefer the A&H if given the option.

[Bobbsy]

Totally ;) response inspired by Gareth Owen's post:

 

 

How many sound engineers does it take to select a "standard" sound desk?

 

Thirteen. Twelve to debate the relative merits of A&H vs. Soundcraft, and Gareth Owen to buy the next round!

 

I'll get my coat....

 

Bob

[Gareth Owen]

Totally ;) response inspired by Gareth Owen's post:

 

 

How many sound engineers does it take to select a "standard" sound desk?

 

Thirteen. Twelve to debate the relative merits of A&H vs. Soundcraft, and Gareth Owen to buy the next round!

 

I'll get my coat....

 

Bob

Ba doom chi!

[Chris Adam]

I think that both desks have their pros and cons in terms of sound, but the allen and heath is by far a better choice for your main venue. To have the option of a few extra channels at hand makes perfect sense.

 

Both desks operate in the same way, but you have that little bit extra flexability with the A+H. I would guess that when a visiting company comes in, you give technical support to them and assist if need be, so where is the problem?

 

I'd also guess that if someone doesn't know how to work the allen and heath, they would also have the same issues with the soundcraft as there's not much you can do wrong (apart from the mixing part)

 

The Allen and Heath is a completely standard analogue board, so is the soundcraft. I've got one of the A+H boards for small gigs and it's great what you get in a small package (no jokes please ha ha)

 

good luck. I hope your tech manager can be talked round. Especially if it's you who has to mix the shows.

[SoLiEn]

Apart from the misconception your boss has about the A&H not being standard, does he have any other genuine reasons for wanting the soundcraft back in the main house? he might have an underlying reason, or he could just be talking bollucks

 

I laughed at the OT joke btw.

[Rob_Beech]

There has to be an underlying reason.

 

Does he or someone he knows and likes know how to use the soundcraft but not the A&H due to a lack of knowledge. Has someone told him that Soundcraft make better desks so he thinks that the Live 4 is better than the GL?