chatterbox Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 We have been asked to mic up a moving parade. We have done the gig before but only in a set place. We will be placing 2 or 3 speakers at the meeting point. At the main mix point there will be a speaker and then a further 2 - one of which will be connected via a speaker cable from the mixer as normal. As we cannot run cables across the road - the other will be on a radiolink (using a line into an instrument type radio pack at the mixer point and then placing the receiver over by the other speaker and plugging into an amp and then into that speaker. This is how we have done this gig in previous years. The band has not mic'd up - only the presenters who are in a static place. This year however they want to mic up the marching brass band that will be walking at the front of the parade, and also have a couple of speakers following at the back of the parade - so everyone can hear the brass band, both those in the parade and those at the meeting point. The parade could be as long as 200 metres, and will be at least 1 km away from the mixer at the farest point. I dont think this can be done at a price that is affordable by the client, but would welcome your thoughts/suggestions. We can get a couple of small generators that could be in the vehicles in the parade, so power is not a problem. We also have 12 volt and 100 volt line equipment available, but I forsee the problem being the radios - with the distance involved and the fact that there will not be line of sight..... SO... how many mics would you suggest to mic the marching band, and what placements....and suggestions on how to transmit the signals from the mics to the mixer etc etc........ Thanks,CHATTERBOX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris4monitors Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Wow you do have a technical prob to solve. In real terms I think it will not happen without a lot of expence and planning. You could get something to work if the marching band were to play / display in an arena but to do a parade I think not. The distances would be to much and you would need a lot of wireless mics (one for each player) in my guess at least 20 + ? I do wish you luck ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleah Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I'm no expert, there may be a workable solution that doesn't cost the earth in terms of man power or kit.... Personally, I'd look at it like a risk assessment. What do they want to do?..... (as per OP)Can we do it? - mmm...Not really Solution - Tell 'em it can't be done! Not very helpful, but may have to be the answer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ynot Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 If the idea here is to transmit the sound of this band across to the rear of the procession I'd ask one of my usual questions... Why? OK, if this is a long parade, then no, the back end will unlikely be able to hear the band, but does that really matter? What sort of event is it? It also sounds as though you want to also transmit the band playing to the destination arena... yes?So you have two PA points - the rear of the parade and the arena, but with the mixing being done at the arena...? This sounds horrendously complex to achieve, will NOT be cheap and opens you to all sorts of issues. Your average theatre radio mic won't have nearly enough range to carry the signals over a km so you'll need something with much higher power output on the RF and that leads to specific licencing issues and costs. Good luck - though I suspect this is a bit of a no-brainer, especially on a budget! (An afterthought - you haven't had a parade director who's been to Disneyland recently, have you...???) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Ross Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I would echo what has been said before and say it a no go. However if you are willing to take the risk how about something like this Each band member has a normal radio mic which the receivers in a pickup that is travelling along with the parade. On this pickup is also a sound guy with some good enclosed headphones. The engineer has the outputs of his/her desk connected to a laptop with a mobile broadband card streaming the audio over the internet. Back at the main base another laptop is connected and is streaming this audio to the main PA I guess your main problems would be latency and possible audio dropout if you lost the internet connection however it would be POSSIBLE just not recommended! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ynot Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Each band member has a normal radio mic You REALLY want to consider trying to mix a marching band whilst they're on the move, in potentially wet weather, whilst you're a kilometre away....? :huh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smalljoshua Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I would have something a kin to the runner cams on the marathon. Put 2 people at the front of the band with a pickup Mic each and a radio Mic transmitter. Have similar at intervals between the front and the back of the band. Put the receivers at the back of the band where the first lot of sound would be required. Mix them there and send the feed via the mobile broadband to the destination area. Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chatterbox Posted February 25, 2009 Author Share Posted February 25, 2009 Thanks all, You are confirming what I already thought - not really possible without alot of expense and planning.... I will let my client know.. Just wanted to check through this forum that I hadn't missed some very obvious solution .... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbuckley Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 The real problem is that brass bands are not at all quiet so a chunk of the audience will be able to hear both the band and the PA, and there'll be a significantly different arrival time for the reinforcement compared to the direct sound. Ugly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dosxuk Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 The engineer has the outputs of his/her desk connected to a laptop with a mobile broadband card streaming the audio over the internet. Back at the main base another laptop is connected and is streaming this audio to the main PA I guess your main problems would be latency and possible audio dropout if you lost the internet connection however it would be POSSIBLE just not recommended! send the feed via the mobile broadband to the destination area. I can't believe you've both suggested using mobile broadband to send audio 1km! Apart from the issues with latency and dropout (which will happen), you've got the cost of getting the kit and the cost of sending that much data. A single high powered (compared to a normal radio mic, but not in the grand scheme) radio link between a mixing point with the band and the other foh point would be far cheaper, more resilient and easier to set up and keep working. I would have something a kin to the runner cams on the marathon. I'm not really sure what you're talking about here... the cameras on bikes following the runners are uplinked to a helicopter which then rebroadcasts the signals to a central recieve point. Surely you're not suggesting hiring a helicopter?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6th Order Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 That's exactly what I thought of; with no way of over coming that problem, unless the band mimes.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smalljoshua Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Runners who are further back, but still are celebs, have runners with cameras on their backs run in front of them. This then links to a near by car with a wireless signal. 2 people with shotgun Mic's, a phantom power unit and a beltpack transmitter. A car, large enough for someone to mix signals from the Mic's, follows along at the back of the band. This car then relays the signal using a compressed bandwidth mono signal over a mobile broadband connection. There is more than enough bandwidth on these things to send one of these. Just pickup a Pay as you go one from 3 or similar. It has a 3GB limit and will work fine for this. When you get close enough for latency to be a problem you will probably be close enough to the destination to be able to use an IEM transmitter or similar. when you decide to switch to the IEM just get the presenters to do a fill allowing you to fade between the 2 without anyone hopefully noticing. Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 I can't believe you've both suggested using mobile broadband to send audio 1km! Apart from the issues with latency and dropout (which will happen), you've got the cost of getting the kit and the cost of sending that much data. A single high powered (compared to a normal radio mic, but not in the grand scheme) radio link between a mixing point with the band and the other foh point would be far cheaper, more resilient and easier to set up and keep working. Although I'd never dream of attempting this with a mobile broadband setup, the costs would actually be minimal. Laptop+sound card - probably easily scroungeable. Mobile broadband subscription - say 10-15 pounds a month. The data transfer requirements are actually quite moderate. But the latency and unreliablility would make it not-very-suitable for this application. Been there, done something very similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Ross Posted February 26, 2009 Share Posted February 26, 2009 Each band member has a normal radio mic You REALLY want to consider trying to mix a marching band whilst they're on the move, in potentially wet weather, whilst you're a kilometre away....? ;) ;) My point was to mix the band “locally” off the back of a pickup truck which tracks along with the band so only a few meters away. The LR mix is then sent via the internet/high powered radio link back to the main PA I would not really recommend doing this at all but that would be an example of if I had a gun to my head and was told to make something that could work Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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