dannyboy1981 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Hi all I'm currently coordinating a production of Grease at my school (I'd be the poor sod that is the music teacher), and as well as rehearsing up musicians and singers, it's also my job to spec extra equipment we need to hire in and sort out a 'crew'. I myself am actually experienced in studio recording, but live experience is limited to doing small PAs for function bands I've played in or sound for school events with bands. After doing some research, I started to brick it at the prospect of having all these wireless mics, plus band, etc. So am looking for some tips to avoid obvious pitfalls my naive young self may fall into without sage like advice. The venue is a typical school hall, aircraft hanger height ceiling, hard surfaces everywhere, mirrors at the back (dance studio space), floor to ceiling windows on the left hand side of the room as you face the stage. The stage is raised a few steps and has very small wings. The band will be playing (don't think I'm mad, its the only place) off the stage on another raised area that is just out of audience view as they look directly at the stage. Therefore the band will be slightly in front of the singers but hard right as you face the stage in what could almost be considered an alcove. The band will consist of:DrumsBassKeyboard2 x E. Guitar2 x Flute2 x Alto SaxTenor SaxClarinet There are many principals in the production, and quite a few whole cast songs. Ideally the producer of the production (head of drama) has asked for all T-birds and Pink ladies to be mic'd. Therefore I'll probably need 12 wireless mics (approx) After advice in another thread, I'm looking at hiring:3 Sennheiser G2 4 Channel Radio Mic Kit 3 Sennheiser ASP212 Sennheiser G2 EM500 Receiver12 Sennheiser G2 SK300 6 Sennheiser Active UHF Antenna 3 Long UHF N Ant Cable 3 Short UHF N Ant Cable 12 PULSE Headset Kit I'm lucky to have the following PA:HK Actor DXYamaha EMX5016cf powered mixerDi boxes30m MulticoreAll necessary leads I've also been offered a pair of EV 12" mons for the production, and a feedback ferrett should I wish. I'd like to think I have a good of ears, well studio production was my big thing, the part that scares me about the live work is the logistics and problem solving quickly. I really want the production to run smooth and seem as pro as possible. Can anyone think of anything I'm truly missing or dismissing in terms of sound? Are there any things you would definitely do or not do in my situation? Thanks in advance,Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tolley1466 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Have you got enough mic stands? and any signal processing? Also the HK Actor DX, isn't this an active system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannyboy1981 Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Have you got enough mic stands? and any signal processing? Also the HK Actor DX, isn't this an active system? Yep, good point, I have enough mic stands though. Processing - the desk has 2 spx fx in built, and 1 knob compression on the 1st 8 channels. Besides that, I have 2 behringer composers, 2 multigates and a behringer fx processor. I prefer the yamaha reverbs and delays though. The HK is indeed active. 1 active top, 1 active sub and 1 passive sub a side. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Can anyone think of anything I'm truly missing An assistant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tolley1466 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I agree, many hands make light work! If you have a powered mixer are you using the line outs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannyboy1981 Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Can anyone think of anything I'm truly missing An assistant. Don't get me started... The amount of times I've discussed a technician with management! Luckily I've got some savvy students, obviously no real substitute for someone with experience, but better than nowt. A concurrent post has been automatically merged from this point on. I agree, many hands make light work! If you have a powered mixer are you using the line outs? Yeah, it's a great little desk, but has balanced jack outs rather than XLR, which I thought was odd considering the rest of it's spec. But have balanced jack to male XLR leads anyway. I use the 500w-a-side amps to power mons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tolley1466 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Oh and, will you need to hire licenses for those 12 radio mics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannyboy1981 Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Oh and, will you need to hire licenses for those 12 radio mics? The hire companies I've looked at have included that with their quotes. So far the gear I listed as being hired is coming it at about £1k exc VAT, but we don't pay VAT being a school. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smalljoshua Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Where abouts are you based? There may be a member on here who will be willing to help for Some Beer Tokens. Josh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cedd Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Just to clarify, you're talking about hiring 3 x 4 channel radio mic kits, then are the 12 EM500's included in these kits or are they extra? I guess you've talked to the hire company and so know better than me, but I'd have thought that your 4 channel radio mic kit would include receiver and transmitter so you wouldn't have to mention them seperately. I'd suggest having a couple of extra headsets in there, there's always the chance of loosing one and then you've had it! You've only got 12 channels on that mixer, so only just enough for your radio mics. With having quite a few chorus numbers and such like, you might like to look at a few stage mics, perhaps a pair of Crown PCC160's and maybe some overheads. With these you'll need extra channels. You may also need a mic for your own announcements at the start. I also seem to recall a wired mic used in the school prom by the singer with the band (Born to handjive?). Either way, I'd be looking at a bigger mixer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tolley1466 Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 A kick drum mic? Its amazing how easily it gets lost... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannyboy1981 Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Where abouts are you based? There may be a member on here who will be willing to help for Some Beer Tokens. Josh Blandford in north Dorset. It's between Dorchester and Shaftsbury... Think tractors and fields. It's a school, so no beer tokens, but I'm sure a 6pack or 2 can be arranged for anyone wanting to get involved. I'll say it again though, it's Grease. Runs from 4th-7th March. Dan Ps, anyone think I should be looking at hanging mics, boundary mics or shotguns to pic up ensemble singing? Just worried I only have leads mic'd so far. I plan to have mics changing backstage, as we'd never really have more than 12-14 onstage at a time talking. But in full cast songs, I may need to mic the stage somehow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J Pearce Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I managed grease on 10 with changes, I'll have a dig around to see if I can show you how I did it. It did involve a good mic tech backstage who I knew I could trust though... Definitely get some mics in for the ensemble, perhaps even submix them on a smaller mixer then bring them into a stereo channel of your main desk (as I did for Grease, the forestage rifles and m/s and u/s overheads all went into a little mackie desk). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannyboy1981 Posted January 12, 2009 Author Share Posted January 12, 2009 Just to clarify, you're talking about hiring 3 x 4 channel radio mic kits, then are the 12 EM500's included in these kits or are they extra? I guess you've talked to the hire company and so know better than me, but I'd have thought that your 4 channel radio mic kit would include receiver and transmitter so you wouldn't have to mention them seperately. I'd suggest having a couple of extra headsets in there, there's always the chance of loosing one and then you've had it! You've only got 12 channels on that mixer, so only just enough for your radio mics. With having quite a few chorus numbers and such like, you might like to look at a few stage mics, perhaps a pair of Crown PCC160's and maybe some overheads. With these you'll need extra channels. You may also need a mic for your own announcements at the start. I also seem to recall a wired mic used in the school prom by the singer with the band (Born to handjive?). Either way, I'd be looking at a bigger mixer. EM500s are extra, so no duplication Good call on extra headsets! I'm thinking about submixing, have another smaller mixer available, if budget allows, I'll look to hire - any recommendations? Just posted about the overheads. I'll look into the crowns, but was wondering if my NT5s might do the trick? Got a matched pair. We'll use a prop probably for Born to Handjive and keep the singer on radio mic, unless you think that's foolhardy? As for kick drum post, got one of my own RE20s for studio days, that should do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmills Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 I don't see any eq on that list, and you will need a lot of rehearsal time (And a fully marked up script) to get to the point where you are not cutting off the beginning of lines or leaving mics open backstage. Radio happy shows need to be mixed literally line by line, and you will NEED someone backstage to handle problems at that end of the venue. Just getting the right pack on the right actor can be a logistical nightmare. You assistant will need communications with you so problems can be sorted quickly. Do not, under any circumstances, allow actors to switch their own packs on and off, they WILL forget, turn it on before handing it over and off when you get it back, put tape over the controls the rest of the time. Don't forget to budget for spare batteries, use half used ones for rehearsal next time, but a show always gets new ones, and any battery in an open packet is deemed to be part used. You have sorted the radio licenses you will need? Don't forget to plan for the time it will take to get everything set up and any frequency co ordination issues resolved. I have to admit that if I was in your shoes, I would dump at least half the radio kit and spend the money on a good vocal coach for a day or two, it will make far more difference both now and to future shows. Given the nature of the show, a few handhelds being passed around can actually work rather well if the director is prepared to block in the required passes. Regards, Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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