lxkev Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 I've just been told that the management they want a fly tower ;) So currently got various building contractors coming to work out how to do this :) However I need some advice on flying systems..... Ideally I’m looking for a system then can be automated. Currently looking at http://www.stagetech.com/machinery/beamhoist.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmills Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 Have you seen how slow those things are (0.5 or 1M per minute), probably fine for lighting bars, but decidedly useless for scenic flying!I would look for something altogether more conventional if you have the structural integrity to take it, but the correct solution clearly depends on your situation. Whatever you do, having a grid is a good thing, just bolting motors to the roof will be a decision you are cursing in short order. Retrofit flytower? Well, interesting if you can pull it off! Regards, Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImagineerTom Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 Ring one of the professions and get them to do this as a turnkey job - designing a flytower, kitting it out, getting it certified AND ending up with something that's actually practical yourself is almost impossible (and definitly not worth the hassle) so give it to somone who know's what they're doing. Unuseual Rigging would be my choice but to be honest there's very little variation in flytowers. Last time I priced up a manual counterweight set cost £6k / bar for the hardwear and motorised systems were around £20k / bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GRisdale Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 Have you seen how slow those things are (0.5 or 1M per minute) That'll be 1m per second - not slow at all, even by Linford Christie's standards... I've been looking at a similar project for our venue for quite a while, and since the structure doesn't permit the use of a counter-weight system have been checking out the various powered options. Essentially the Stage Technologies' systems are pretty much the Rolls Royce standard based on all I've seen and heard - but you do have to pay for it... From memory a Beamhoist will cost you about £10k per bar and the control system is also pretty dear (a Nomad is about £30k I think...). They are the best units of their type though - very quiet. They're also very nice people so I'd definately suggest giving them a ring - they've got an open day coming up at the Leicester Curve theatre who have a fully automated rig by them - a good excuse for a day out on expenses if ever I heard one. Centre Stage Engineering also have some similar products of interest. Their alternative to the Beamhoist is a Tri Band hoist which is about half the price and very well featured. If you do choose to go down the automated route staffing will be a key issue also - manual flymen are a bit easier to come by (and train) than automation board ops. I'd definately second Tom's advice, but also recommend that you talk to a few companies initially - don't just go with the first phone number you lay your hands on. Every company will give you a slightly different solution, one of them being the best for you, so it's worth getting a few opinions - my 2p. Gareth. Editted to add links. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulears Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 When the powers that be mention a fly tower, do they mean they wish to add one where there isn't one already, because the cost may well surprise them, making the hoists the simple bit! My local college have plans to do the same thing - adding a fly tower to a big sports hall - probably end up being a distaster knowing them. They have heard the term, and want one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmills Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 Whoops, I have no idea where I got 1M/minute from, been playing with chain hoists too much obviously! 1M/s is indeed far more useful. I would second the advice about getting one of the big rigging companies involved in the project management and design, not just the fittings. Ordinary architects and structural engineers tend not to appreciate what theatre people try to do to their buildings and always underestimate everything from imposed loads to power requirements to toilet provision! Asking for this as an RFP for a turn key project to a few of the major stage engineering companies seems wise. Regards, Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gareth Posted January 10, 2009 Share Posted January 10, 2009 If they really do want to add a fly tower, as in actually add a fly tower to a building that doesn't already have one (as Paul suggested) and then kit it out with power flying facilities, then I'd venture to suggest that it's absolutely pointless even beginning to think about what you're going to put into the fly tower until you've had planning permission for it. A lot of local authority planners seem to be a bit funny about allowing permission for things to grow upwards these days, depending on where you are and what's around you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mac.calder Posted January 11, 2009 Share Posted January 11, 2009 Your best bet is to contact a supplier to provide a turn key solution. This has a number of advantages: One, your support will all come from the one place (ie they will cover everything from wiring to encoders to controllers and limit switches) Two, it ensures you get a system without things "missing" Three, the overall cost is generally cheaper Some people to look at (In no particular order): Waagner Beuro Batalpha BobachStage AutomationAVWState AutomationKinesysFisher Technical ServicesSkjonberg Now a number of these companies are not local - however generally a project like adding a motorised fly tower (complete with fly tower) is a multi-million dollar job and so locality is often not an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tokm Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 Just add another name to the list of people to try.. though I admit they're likely to only be able to help with the rigging/flying side of the project, but still.. could be useful. Hall Stage T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emj Posted January 12, 2009 Share Posted January 12, 2009 If money is no object I would go for stage technologies for all bell and whistles. For cost effectiveness and helpfulness can not fault Dave and the boys at MRL systems www.entertainment-engineering.co.uk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianknight Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I would go with the vew expressed in a couple of posts - make sure the building and its foundations plus the ground it stands on can support a fly tower first. The loads have to go somewhere - either in to the existing building or in to the ground and neither may be feasible if the foundations of the building and the ground it's stood on can't take that. Just because there's lots of steelwork about doesn't mean that it can take added loads easily! I'm mindful of the a civic hall in an ex-mining community - applied for a lottery grant for an orchestra pit to be added to the main auditorium, bid was successful - structural engineer was consulted and said an emphatic "No". It turns out that the building was above old mine workings and so was built on a foundation 'raft' - cutting through that to form the 'pit' would have seriously weakend the building. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Lewis Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 I would go with the vew expressed in a couple of posts - make sure the building and its foundations plus the ground it stands on can support a fly tower first. It seems Kev's not been back to tell us more, but I can tell you that the theatre is quite a nice space in a very standard 1960s single story school sport block. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will_Tech Posted January 19, 2009 Share Posted January 19, 2009 Have a look at nippy industries - www.nippyindustries.co.uk they do all rigging and automated fly work and are also verlinde stockists so you can get the gear from them too. What area is it in ?As I also know a very good professional building company. Will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lxkev Posted January 19, 2009 Author Share Posted January 19, 2009 Hello Thanks for all your replys and extra info. At the moment the site architects are talking to a consultant. The project going to happen in phases, first the building work......This is going to involve removing the current stage floor and creating a suitable foundations to hold the fly towers frame... Stage 2... Installing the hardware So when I know more info and if ever going to happen, I will post detail plans and will be contacting a few of this companies in relation to the hardware.... Thanks Again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gareth Posted January 19, 2009 Share Posted January 19, 2009 While I don't doubt your capability for a moment, Kev, this project sounds like one which should be entrusted to an experienced theatre consultant. In many ways, you're building a venue (well, a fundamental part of it at least) from scratch, and the involvement of an independent consultant (one who isn't working for any of the contractors or suppliers) to make lots of design input and help with project management is invaluable in such situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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