School disco and strobe

[Blaize110]

I am aware this has been convered to some extent in the safety FAQs but I would like people's oppinion on my situation if thats ok.

 

Our school is holding a disco next week and we have a small SoundLab strobe. Other members of the crew uneasy about its use as they dont wish to be help responsible for any epileptic fits. I would like to use it have said I would put up strobe warnings on the door and remove it if an epileptic person makes themselves known. I also pointed out that a photo-sensitive individual is unlikely to be going to a disco containing flashing lights. This would only be for short bursts of about 3-5 seconds at a time a few times during the night.

 

What are everyones views on the subject? Are certiain individuals being overly safety conscious or is the risk a large enough one to warrant removing it from the event?

[Alpha]

Disco === Flashing Lights === Fact

Your right its unlikely for a photo-sensative indicidual to be there however you can't rule it out. Make sure you've got big clear signs up in every well lit area you have so there are no excuses for people not knowing. I've used strobes for all sorts of periods of time for school shows and discos.

 

People can be over saftey concious, at the end of the day it's down to whoever is responsible for H&S on site. If he or she is happy for there to be strobe, then let there be strobe.

[djw1981]

When I was at school, this was covered in the school H&S policy - talk to the teacher responsible for the disco, or the facilities manager / bursar / deputy head etc responsible for fabric. Their policy then was that is one photo-sensitive person was present and known (either through voluntary declaration, or their comparing register of ticket sales to school health forms) then no strobing effects could be used.

 

My advice would be that if you do have such fixtures site and are not using them, that they are in a locked store, and a member of staff sees that they are all there prior to doors opening, thus you can prove that there were none present.

[themadhippy]

Don't schools use strobes in science classes ?

[djw1981]

Don't schools use strobes in science classes ?

In my school, again, only if there were no photosensitive pupils present. The teacher would often ask them to step out and demonstrate the effect, then ask them to come back in. Thus they had to learn it 'by theory' alone.

[Jamie Everington]

I used to do mobile DJing, we used to just ask the organisers if we could used strobes. Then it was their problem!

When using strobes for college performances we put up signs saying that we were using strobes. You could go to extremes and ask every single person if they are ok with strobe lighting.

I think H&S say no more than 3mins at a time, don't quote me on that!

[paulears]

About 7 or 8 years ago I had a fit in the middle of the night. After zillions of horrible tests they just said they didn't know what it was, I wasn't epileptic and was an SSS (single solitary seizure). Never had another one since then - BUT, every show I do that suddenly has bright strobes, or moving heads doing a strobe, I just close my eyes till it's gone. Nobody told me to do it, but I just do - for safety really. They just make me on edge and jittery - a kind of impending doom type feeling. Probably very irrational - but not much I can do about it. I think the main worry isn't from people who know they're susceptible, it's a danger to the people who don't. So 'strobe lighting in use' I never worry about too much. If FOH forget (which they usually do) it isn't a problem, because people with issues, just close their eyes and don't get the trigger. The danger is to people like me before I had my trouble. I never knew (and still don't) if a strobe will set me off. Part of the tests are strobes at various frequencies, and nothing happened - so I'm pretty sure my fit was just a random thing - a one-off. BUT - I don't want to take the chance. Since then, I've noticed that I don't include strobing in anything I do - and it's not caused a problem. If people at school are concerned, why bother taking the chance - it's a very small, infrequent part of the night - so would it really be missed?

[jamed2017]

I always announce it over the microphone,

 

Flashing lights and strobes, problem, you know where the door is.

 

The fact is if you have epplipsey u dont want to be coming to a disco.

 

DISCO=Flashing lights.

I'm photo sensitive to migrain. Which can lead to bad things but again like paul if it gets to much I just close my eyes till its over, OR I leave. And if im in controll I turn them off till im good to use them again.

 

 

announce it, put some signs up. Be rite.

[J Pearce]

The fact is if you have epplipsey u dont want to be coming to a disco.

 

Firstly, that sort of comment could get you into a very interesting position regarding DDA, and secondly I find it an extremely inconsiderate and arrogant viewpoint. Why shouldn't someone who suffers from photosensitive epilepsy be able to enjoy a disco or club night, when often all that is needed is minimised use of strobes or a hold on maximum frequency.

 

Yes, strobes can look very good when used at the right point/for an effect, but equally they are often over-used just for the sake of it and can be very aggravating.

 

In theatre type situations I get FOH to make me aware if someone has identified themselves as having problems with a strobe and then either modify the plot or tell them where the strobe is used and supply them with a blindfold for use in that scene.

 

For busking (music gigs, club nights) if I am made aware of someone who has a problem with strobes then I'll try to have a chat with them and see what I can and can't do.

[LXbydesign]

So long as you have clear signage on all doors into the venue and stick to the permitted use of strobe light , then there is no problem at all.

 

The same rules apply regardless of what the venue is - be it a school or a theatre or an arena gig.

[KevinE]

It's not just strobes that can set someone off, though. Any modern disco effect light can have a strobe, colour or gobo scroll or flash effect, a scanner..colour changer..even dappled sunlight through trees is a reported trigger. I've witnessed someone having a fit in a nightclub..I dont think there was a strobe going that night, I would say that any bright flashing light in a dark environment would do it, I dunno. It certainly didn't stop them entering the premises!

[Jamtastic3]

I've witnessed someone having a fit in a nightclub..I dont think there was a strobe going that night, I would say that any bright flashing light in a dark environment would do it, I dunno.

 

This may have been triggered through heat, exhaustion and anxiety. I've got a friend who has epilepsy that isn't triggered by strong strobing.

[SoLiEn]

interestingly, sounds can also set of a seizure in rare cases. Signage is the key, and stick to the safety regs for use of a strobe. its not 3 minutes at a time, that is like saying I will strobe for the entire of this song.

 

I think its maximum of one minute then a 3 minute break but dont quote me on that, ill do some digging and get back to you.

 

EDIT: okay, here is something from a quick google search...

 

 

"Strobe Lighting Regulations

 

 

There is no legislation covering the use of strobe lighting specifically. However, in places of public entertainment the licensing authority may choose to set conditions on the use of strobe lighting effects as part of the license.

 

Guidance exists in 'The Event Safety Guide - A guide to health, safety and welfare at music and similar events', published by the Health and Safety Executive. This is the recently published second edition that is known as the 'Pop Code'. The guidance on this document is not legally binding but paragraph 6 notes that entertainment licensing authorities may refer to this guide when considering appropriate license conditions.

 

Chapter 17 of the guide, dealing with special effects, fireworks and pyrotechnics, includes some advice on strobe lighting as follows:

 

"Carefully consider the use of strobe lights, as under some conditions they may induce epilepsy in flicker-sensitive individuals. Whenever strobe lights are used, arrange for a prior warning to be given at the entrance to the event or in the programme.

 

If strobe lights are used, keep flicker rates at or below four flashes per second. Below this rate it is estimated that only 5% of the flicker-sensitive population will be at risk of an attack. This flicker rate only applies to the overall output of any group of lights in direct view, but where more than one strobe light is used the flashes should be synchronised.

 

To reduce the risk further, mount lights as high above head height as is practicable. Where possible, the lights should be bounced off walls and ceilings or diffused by other means so that glare is reduced. They should not be used in corridors or on stairs. Continuous operation of strobe lighting for long periods should be avoided. Further information is available in the HSE HELA guidance note 'Disco lights and flicker-sensitive epilepsy'."

 

 

To summarize:

 

• There is no law covering strobe lighting specifically.
  
• HSE guidance is published as above but is not legally binding.
  
• Requirements for operation may be set by the licensing authority.
  

Reference:

 

'The Event Safety Guide - A guide to health safety and welfare at music and similar events' is published by the Health and Safety Executive, reference HSG195, ISBN 0 7176 2453 6. It is available from HSE Books for GBP 20 - telephone 01787 881165."

[techwsussex]

As the only epileptic technician I ever met, this is what I do:

 

BIG signs to cover your back.

 

No more than about 5/6 Hz rate.

 

10 second bursts max, and a reasonable pause between.

 

One in 200 people is epileptic, and about one in 200 of them are actually photosensitive. Overall fits are caused by strobes in about 1 in 20000 people. Making it a low risk, so if you risk assess it and put the above measures in place, and have your full compliment of crowd management in place, you're probably ok. Anyone trying to sue would be hard pressed to win if your venue had all the signage etc in place.

 

Besides, soundlab strobes are so ineffective that it won't matter, no one will notice...

[Ynot]

Making it a low risk, so if you risk assess it and put the above measures in place, and have your full compliment of crowd management in place, you're probably ok. Anyone trying to sue would be hard pressed to win if your venue had all the signage etc in place.

Have to have a wry smile here, as the 'venue' is a school and 'crowd management' will likely be a few over-worked and bored teachers...!

Still, the art dept can have a fun project coming up with some signs, though...