To fly, or not to fly - 15" subs

[palantir]

Evening all,

 

I have the chance to try-out my new (to me) Sound kit for the first time in anger this weekend:

 

The kit consists of a pair of Mackie ART300 (12"+comp. horn - 102 dB [1 watt @ 1 metre])

" Ohm RWS subs (15" with LF filter - 101 dB " "

Yamaha PC2002 Amp (400 watt/side @ 4 ohms)

" Q2031 Graphic EQ

 

At the moment I don't have a 2nd Amp for the subs, but the Yamahaha delivers plenty of poke for the planned show.

 

The hall is about 20m X 11m X 6m high (Plus stage) & the mackies will be on custom-made brackets (made by Me :P my welding's more functional than pretty but it stays welded) some 4.5m high, either side of the proscenium, aimed down at the middle row.

 

For our last show, I borrowed a pair of 18" subs, which stood on the floor below & slightly inboard of the mains, just ahead of the apron. As we have a sprung floor, I hoped it would be excited by the lower frequencies, but this didn't seem to happen too much. so the question is; Does the Team think............

 

Would it be worth while trying to get the (Quite compact) subs into the air &, if so, how high?

I'll be using 3 boundary mics on the front edge of the stage + a couple of small condensers hung mid-stage.

 

As always, any suggestions gratefully accepted

 

Pete

[johndenim]

Sorry Pete, not much help but I have never seen subs flown, (other than some small line array systems) does the manufacturer recommend flying these cabs?

 

As I understand it only specific speakers are intended to be suspended, mounting points are needed and there is always H&S to consider.

Subs are designed to be sat on the floor, I don't think you would really benefit from flying them.

 

John Denim.

[palantir]

Hi John

That's what I've always understood, but I came accross a thread a while back that referred to another which aparrentlydiscussed using smallish subs off the floor to "Move the air, not the floor".

 

I think I must have been dreaming, as I can't find anything like that on the BR :P

 

Pete

[dunk_1984]

It isn't unheard of to fly subs, providing they have they correct mounts there is no reason not to fly subs. Paired with something more hefty on the ground.

[Kevin Ross]

Maybe if you want to get more output from the subs you could try centre clustering them in the middle so you would get the (theoretical) 6db increase in output.

 

Might also be worth thinking about aux fed subs if you are going to have boundary mics close to them.

[paulears]

I really cannot see the point. You can fly them with the correct kit,and the big boys fly subs all the time. My problem is that with your flown cardioids and boundaries - you won't have any bass to stick through them. Boundaries often end up with the low end trimmed right off to get rid of the thumps and bumps - so going to al that effort for a bass light production does seem a bit odd. Maybe if you were doing something with a mad bass player and heavy footed drummer, it would work well?

[Matt Riley]

Also, when the big boys fly subs, they're often paired with other subs on the ground. If you are going to fly then you'll lose output because the subs won't couple with the floor (although it does sound like the sprung floor is preventing this anyway.) If I were you I'd go for clustering them at the front, or putting one each side close to the wall so it couples to that as well.

 

Also, for future reference if anyone does decide to go for homemade flying brackets, you are playing a bit of a liability lottery. I personally value my liability insurance (and my solvency) and so make sure that anything that goes up in the air goes up using rated flying hardware (including eyebolts), and preferably manufacturer supplied flying frames.

 

M