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How big a PA for this job ?


BigYinUK

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Doug, I see what you are saying. You are correct, even some of the larger companies still work on 10kW 20kW 4 kW as it's a simple way to separate the smaller systems from the larger ones (when comparing the same boxes to more of the same boxes). The only down side is of course, one company might supply you something decent of 10kW such as some KF850 or indeed your HK system, and the next company might put 10kW of Skytec in for a quarter of the money.

 

Slightly OT, but this is often why some of the systems that don't quite sound as good as others, are more popular. If a company has a lot of a particular box, they become popular in the area as people know where they stand with them. Floodlight is a good example. Around here, everyone has it. It's not the best sounding box in the world, it certainly isn't one of my favourites, but it can sound very good, and you know exactly what its going to sound like and pretty much exactly what it's going to do when you set it up.

 

 

 

Rob

 

A concurrent post has been automatically merged from this point on.

 

But Paul, we naturally assume that with the touring grade systems the amplifiers will be capable of driving the speakers properly to and beyond their rms levels. so 4 stacks of floodlight driven at rms level (about 5kW) and then driven at 2 x rms level (what we expect our amps to deliver) is 10kW. But if we constantly push 10kW into the system it will eventually fail. the 5000watts of headroom is a mere 3dB, it's barely another light on the desk. So whilst we keep our signal clean with our 3dB of headroom, a loud vocal part, or a crazy drum fill is going to give you more than 3dB extra.

 

So we can label 4 stacks as 10kW, as technically we'd expect amps to be rated to this, but what exactly can we run the system at constantly whilst keeping a reasonable amount of headroom. We can over compress things, but then the sound suffers.

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You can't run sine waves into a pa that are twice the rms rating of the drivers. However music is not sine waves and has a higher crest factor which is why you can power speakers with approximately 2xRms. If you aren't hitting the limiters then you can run it at that output all night long. I agree that it's a bit silly as it's only 3db, but there have been situations I've been in where an extra 3db would have been very nice. From a marketing point of view you'd be mad to spec the lower number even though "it's about spl not watts".
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The gig's open air - wind and air humidity will play a factor in the quality of reproduction you're going to get straight away.

 

And from there the compromises begin!!!!

 

It's all very well looking at various systems etc but you need to think about what's going to happen out there.

 

Firstly, high end is going to be lost to the open air and it will be further exacerbated by any breeze or wind - highly likely in the UK.

Secondly you're outside so background noise levels are up by comparison to normal indoor gigs.

 

In my opinion you need a workhorse system that gives you a combination of grunt and clarity - not something that excels at one or the other.

I'd personally rule out anything from d&b or L'Acoustic as they are lovely clean sounding boxes that will be overly compromised by the situation and elements.

I personally hate Mackie gear (it's the worst culprit for hearing the logo before you see it!!), it colours everything that goes through it.

 

Rob's mention of W8 is a winner for me, it'll give you the power you need while maintaining some of the quality sound that you (personally, the punters will be drunk!) are looking for; more so than many other loudspeakers at high SPL's.

I'd suggest 1 W8C and 1 WSX per side as plenty, or double that up if you can blag/afford it.

There's a lot of W8 floating around presently as many bigger companies have sold of their stocks, so it shouldn't be too hard to find a reasonable deal on it.

If your in Sussex, then give Capital Sound Hire (huge Martin stockpile) a ring and ask what they've got available or if they use any companies near you to supplement their touring rigs.

 

Then stick your HK rig on your stage as sidefills for the band or angle them out slightly to give you guys a bit and those nearest the stage a little bit extra - people who want to hear it at a higher level will always gravitate towards the source, if they stay back, then they want it a bit quieter!

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I'd question how the WSX subs sound on their own, they are very good in multiples, even in 2's but I just find them to be a large box of not alot on their own.

 

The other issue is, I don't think you're going to be able to ground stack W8C on WSX very efficiently. If people are stood infront of it, the entire cabs will be covered. Though similar things can be said for alot of the systems mentioned, but I think a wsx w8c combination would suffer more so.

 

There are lots of options, the one to go for is the one you can financially and practically sort out. It might not be the ideal choice for sound or anything else, but it's a compromise at the end of the day.

 

Rob

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