Which Mixer? - A&H ML5000 or Midas Verona 400?

[stringsgc]

OK hi, newby here. I have to make a choice between an A&H ML5000 or Midas Verona 400.Both run 40 Channel (the A&H is 40 mono + a couple of stereo) (the Verona is 32 Mono with 8 stereo that can be used as mic inputs).Both are as touring pack with twin psu and flightcases.

I run a small P/A hire company with regular theatre band work, quite often multiple local bands over a single night or named/signed artists with support.Currently using a ML3000 32 and do like the VCA options but tempted by the Midas name/rep.

Heath is pretty heavy and Verona quite light so that's also a consideration.

Opinions please.

[Simon Lewis]

I would weigh up:

 

- Whether rider acceptability is an issue. If so, is the Verona acceptable as a "Midas", or does it have to be one of the bigger ones... Also, would your customers accept A&H?

 

- Whether you need the VCAs, additional auxes, LCR panning etc. that the Midas doesn't have.

 

- Whether you need the dual format flexibility that the A&H provides.

 

- Whether your customer can tell the difference in quality

 

- Whether you will make more money with one over the other (including cross rental)

 

- Whether you should include Soundcraft MH series, or second hand Series 5?

[mervaka]

you're looking at buying midas because of the name? to be fair your ML3000 should be more than adequate. what's your reason for upgrading?

[stringsgc]

I would weigh up:- Whether rider acceptability is an issue. If so, is the Verona acceptable as a "Midas", or does it have to be one of the bigger ones... Also, would your customers accept A&H?- Whether you need the VCAs, additional auxes, LCR panning etc. that the Midas doesn't have.- Whether you need the dual format flexibility that the A&H provides.- Whether your customer can tell the difference in quality- Whether you will make more money with one over the other (including cross rental)- Whether you should include Soundcraft MH series, or second hand Series 5?

Hmm.Ok I)rider acceptability is an issue but both Verona and A&H are ok ii)don't necessarily "need" VCA's but I have come accustomed to using them all be it on a basic level with the ML3000.iii) The Midas still has the "sis" option of LRC but again not vital. The dual format isn't really vital as I am using a GL3300 as foldback desk ,on smaller shows I could use this as foh and monitor.iv)most of my customers probably wouldn't be able to tell the difference in quality v)could probably make a little more return for money on dry hire of the Midas.vi)probably should include the Soundcraft but had been put off in the past with reliability issues on lower end Scraft boards - started on a LX7 then a LIVE series then short spells with K1 then K2. Last year got stuck behind a GB whilst working for other company and loathed it.

you're looking at buying Midas because of the name? to be fair your ML3000 should be more than adequate. what's your reason for upgrading?

Partially yes but the Verona offers more flexible EQ with Hi/Hi mid/Lo mid/Lo all swept and the extra 8 channels of either stereo or mic ins would allow us to do less channel sharing on multi band setups. When outside engineers have used our rig for touring bands snob value does seem to come into it a little. Get a few comments along the lines of "only ever used this (ML3000) on foldback , never seen one on foh" etc etc. Other good reason is I have to right some dollar off against tax so either I write gov big fat cheque or replace my mixer.

- Whether you need the dual format flexibility that the A&H provides.

Just checked spec. Midas does offer dual format facility

[Bobbsy]

If the features of the Verona suit you then that's a good reason to go that route. However, I would NOT buy for the "Midas name".

 

The Verona, although bearing the Midas label, owes more of its design to the former DDA boards than to Midas. A bit of history: DDA consoles used to be built in the same factory as Midas, but on a separate assembly line with their own staff. However, "D and D" left the company to form Audient and Midas took over the assembly line to manufacture the Venice and Verona ranges.

 

This is not to say that the Verona isn't a nice board (as were the DDAs before it). If the feature set suits, then go for it. However, don't assume you're getting a "legendary Midas".

 

Personally, I'd probably be tempted by the A&H, if only for the VCAs but only you can answer which features are most important to you.

 

Bob

[bigglesuk]

Or, you could look at the Soundcraft MH range which offers great flexibility and VCA's.

[alex_kyuss]

Hi all, the company I work for has just had the exact same problem.

We went for the A&H, for many reasons,

Cheaper, out of the 3 we thought it was the best quality for money, all 3 desks have the same feature other then the midas doesn't have the VCA's.

We also didn't think that the midas was good enough to warrant the amount more it was (although it is a really good 8 buss), (although we are now saving up for Heritage or a XL4).

We also decided that if a rider really needed a midas then a Verona wouldn't be good enough and we would have to rent a Heritage or a XL4.

hope this helps

Alex

[Shaggy]

I would be seriously looking at the M7CL in that price range as well. Smaller, more versatile, for multiple bands you can save and recall settings for each band.

[NeilW]

There is some previous discussion on here with regards to the Verona. I and many others find the controls to be very light, particularly the gain pots and matrix outputs, which seem to rotate far too freely. So, my comment would be, that as well as judging the console based on the spec sheets, you may wish to get hands on with both of them, not only to be able to judge audio quality, but also to get a feel for the operational feel of them both.

 

Neil

[stringsgc]

I would be seriously looking at the M7CL in that price range as well. Smaller, more versatile, for multiple bands you can save and recall settings for each band.

Def not ready for the digital changeover just yet.I'm hooked on analogue,right or wrong that's another can of worms altogether.+ I don't have £15K for the M7CL !!

There is some previous discussion on here with regards to the Verona. I and many others find the controls to be very light, particularly the gain pots and matrix outputs, which seem to rotate far too freely. So, my comment would be, that as well as judging the console based on the spec sheets, you may wish to get hands on with both of them, not only to be able to judge audio quality, but also to get a feel for the operational feel of them both.Neil

hmm have heard this about controls,it's getting a chance to try out before purchase that's the problem.

[NeilW]

Your profile doesn't say where abouts you are based, there may be someone nearby who has a Verona that you could demo. From memory, the ML5000 controls are not dissimilar to the ML3000.

 

Another thought, you mentioned theatre work, and I would imagine the extra functions that can be found on the ML5000 such as double the number of matrix outputs, double the number of mute groups and the opportunity to store mute scenes may be additional reasons to consider the A&H over the Midas.

 

Neil

[stringsgc]

Your profile doesn't say where abouts you are based, there may be someone nearby who has a Verona that you could demo. From memory, the ML5000 controls are not dissimilar to the ML3000.

 

Another thought, you mentioned theatre work, and I would imagine the extra functions that can be found on the ML5000 such as double the number of matrix outputs, double the number of mute groups and the opportunity to store mute scenes may be additional reasons to consider the A&H over the Midas.

 

Neil

 

hmm all seem heavily in favour of the A&H.Gona have to source a company nearby who have one for a weekend hire.Any ideas near Portsmouth area?

[NeilW]

Allen and Heath will have an idea of who has the console near your area, it might be worth being in touch with forum member Carey D who works for A&H.

 

Neil

[Pete Alcock]

In case is of interest, there's an ML5000 on eBay at the moment, listed for 5 grand. Bigger than I need, but it seems pretty good value!

 

eBay ML5000

 

Pete.

[stringsgc]

In case is of interest, there's an ML5000 on eBay at the moment, listed for 5 grand. Bigger than I need, but it seems pretty good value!

 

eBay ML5000

 

Pete.

 

And to add even more confusion, I have been offered both the Midas Verona 400 and the Allen & Heath ML5000 for exactly the same price from two different suppliers!