Skumling Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 Hi there. In my small band our generics is 4 par56's in each side of the stage on stands. The pars are equipped with 500W halogen lamps and raylight reflectors. As we all know, raylight sucks in many ways, and I am really tired of changing worn out gels all the time. A while ago I had the pars fitted with 300W lamps, and that worked well, but not with nearly as high output. I do not want to change to 1kW par64's or similar (they are too big), and I would hate to make do with 300W's in my exisiting par56's, due to the lack of output. These needs made me think of changing to S4 Par-ish lamps. Is it correct that the 575W versions will have at least as much output as my current par56's with raylight? And is it correct that even with the narrow lens, it will not burn my gels nearly as fast as the raylights? From what I have been able to find on the net, the original ETC S4 Pars are quite expensive, probably TOO expensive for my wallet. But what about the copies - are some of them eventually of a decent quality. What about the Behringer UP1000 e.g. ? Are they okay, or should I go for something else? I am located in Denmark, so sourcing from Germany (Thomann) is quite easy, it is generally more complicated to source from the UK or US, so if you could point me in direction of a product at e.g. Thomann, I would absolutely be happy. /Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRW Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 Not that it's particularly relevant, but in the picture of the item you linked to, the lantern is upside down! :D Slightly more relevant- At the moment, I've got a backwash of 1Kw Par64s up in our theatre, unfortunately I ran out of them so had to use a bar of S4Pars (with HPL750's in) to finish off the downstagey area. The light output from them is noticeably different (much lower) to the Par64s, but if you were to compare them to a 500w Par they would probably match up a bit better. I've also noticed that my S4Par Bar is not as 'punchy' as the real deal, although I'm such this has been discussed before! Ian B-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 How about Par56 uits with 500W PAR lamps (such as CP88 for medium flood)? These would give you a decent output, and be very cheap. They would also match your existing units (leave the raylights open-white for special effects or highlighting)! Just an idea :D Regards,Barney Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lxhipster Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 Why don't you consider changing to LEDs. That would save you a lot of money on lamps, gels and power. You get RGB color mixing and you can have virtually any color you want plus it is easier to setup. It's almost an ONE OFF investment that would save you money on buying spare bulbs, gels and etc. as the lamp life is almost 50,000 hours vs 2000 hours for a P64. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benweblight Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 And would be even dimmer than the 300w par56s....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tomo Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 It's almost an ONE OFF investment that would save you money on buying spare bulbs, gels and etc. as the lamp life is almost 50,000 hours vs 2000 hours for a P64.No, it's not - it's actually closer to 10,000 hours, and much less for certain kinds of LED (eg UV). It's also incredibly dependant on junction temperature - so you'll even see a difference in life between different fixtures using the same dice. LEDs are really good at saturated colours - especially deep blues and reds - but are (currently) very poor at whites. Most of them also have a really poor beam quality - you can clearly see colour fringing from the three (4/5/6/50) different colour sources on many of them, needing a frost to smooth it out. LED lamp life and brightness has been massively overstated by certain manufacturers and resellers - if you look at the LED trade magazines you can see many of the major brands are pushing for more standardised ways of measuring brightness and life, to try to head off the bad publicity that is inevitable if crazy lives and output keep being stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skumling Posted February 14, 2008 Author Share Posted February 14, 2008 How about Par56 uits with 500W PAR lamps (such as CP88 for medium flood)?I have searched quite a lot, and can not find any Par56 500W lamps - the only ones I can find is 120V, but I happen to live in 240V world, and pairing the 120V's is not an option for me. Any links to 500W 240V par56 lamps?/DanielWhy don't you consider changing to LEDs. That would save you a lot of money on lamps, gels and power. You get RGB color mixing and you can have virtually any color you want plus it is easier to setup.We do have some LED kit as well, which we use in bigger setups. But for the basic lighting, I am very pleased with generics to have some decent front light with proper whites. LEDs are cool for some things, but in my opinion certainly have its problems as well.So for now I will just stick with generics in our basic rig./Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 What about the Behringer UP1000 ..I am located in Denmark, so sourcing from Germany (Thomann) is quite easy, it is generally more complicated to source from the UK or US That website states that this particular product is not sold in Europe, only US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tokm Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 Probably a bit like telling you how to suck eggs, but.. If your after a Multi-Par type solution then just go look around the Thomann website! They've got multi-pars in silver or black as well as the proper ETC S4 units.. And IIRC they even had those behringer cans up for sale at one point.. not sure if their on now as I've not looked them up in a while.. Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_hate_fisicks Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 The Showtec S4 Par copies seem to do a credible job, and are very cheap. They also do a similar lamp with some big fat LEDs in, which I'd be very interested to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skumling Posted February 14, 2008 Author Share Posted February 14, 2008 That website states that this particular product is not sold in Europe, only US.No, the website contains a list of countries, where the lantern is not sold, including UK. It is available in stores in Denmark.If your after a Multi-Par type solutionWell, I am mostly after good ideas :-). Multi-Par was my own suggestion to what could be useful, and I will probably end up with them, unless someone else throws a genius hint in my general direction. The 500W lamp idea for my existing par56's could eventually be cool, if it is possible to get them in 240V versions.The Showtec S4 Par copies seem to do a credible job, and are very cheap. They also do a similar lamp with some big fat LEDs in, which I'd be very interested to see.Okay thanks, I'll check the Showtec ones out. I have seen the LED version you are talking about, it contains 24 pcs. 1W LEDs and has a much better output than the 'regular' Showtec LED pars. Colors are nicer, and it is actually able to make something that could look like usable white :D . From what I can see, it is identical to the American DJ Opti Led RGB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 That website states that this particular product is not sold in Europe, only US.No, the website contains a list of countries, where the lantern is not sold, including UK. It is available in stores in Denmark. The website says:USA: AvailableCanada: AvailableLatin America: Not availableEurope: Not availabe(list of other areas): Not available But if you say it is available in Denmark, I will not argue! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve h Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 The Showtec S4 Par copies seem to do a credible job, and are very cheap. They also do a similar lamp with some big fat LEDs in, which I'd be very interested to see. How come the Showtec S4 Pars on thomann (link) have the same pic as the Behringer in the links above? is this just a nice obvious case of rebranding a product? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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