Using clip on lapel mic's for vocals

[Brock]

I am currently setting up for a show in my local High school and was promised the loan of "body mic's" for the main cast roles. These arrived today and turned out to be Sennheiser ew 112 G2 clip on lapel type mic's. These are omnidirectional and from all what I have read good vocal mic's tend to be cardoid.

We already had two of these and have found then very tricky to use due to their sensitivity.

We are now faced with trying to use these mic's for all our main cast vocals. Is this possible or am I fighting a losing battle and would I be better spending the time looking for a different option, (at low cost!!!!)

[Ynot]

I am currently setting up for a show in my local High school and was promised the loan of "body mic's" for the main cast roles. These arrived today and turned out to be Sennheiser ew 112 G2 clip on lapel type mic's.

EW112 G2 is in fact the model number of the Sennheiser transmitter/receiver system - whilst the basic kit quotes an ME-2 omni mic capsule as standard issue, this is by no means the only option available for use.

 

Are you SURE the mic head is an ME-2?

Have you hired or borrowed the kits?

 

You can buy (quite cheaply) ready-made mic heads (flesh or black) from CP (and others) - search the BR here for one of the MANY mic threads and you'll find all sorts of references.

[Simon Lewis]

Whilst the cardioid mic may give you some more gain before feedback, placement is quite important and proximity effect can be a problem, as will the actor moving their head from side to side (i.e. speaking awayfrom the mic.).

 

Either buy some of those low cost but suprisingly effective £30 CPC headset mics, or use the omnis at a slightly lower level and get the actors to speaker loudly and clearly... A carefully set up parametric or graphic may help too.

 

 

Simon

[MarkPAman]

..........get the actors to speaker loudly and clearly.

 

It'll never catch on. :blink:

[Ynot]

Whilst the cardioid mic may give you some more gain before feedback, placement is quite important

 

That's one bit I missed!

Whilst they tend to be called 'lapel' or 'clip-on' mics, they're best used in the hairline of the talent, or taped to the side-burns etc.

For theatre work it's best NOT to clip them to costume lapels or any other location on the body.

[Rob_Beech]

If you position the mic right, and you can get the person wearing it to pretend the mic isn't there then you should be ok, though some eq should still be necessary.

 

By saying pretend the mic isn't there, I don't mean pretend it isn't physically there so you can repeatedly smack yourself in the chest, they have to pretend that the mic isn't helping the sound, they have to try and project the sound to the audience as if the mic isn't there. If they do this, the mic will help them and do it's job, if they expect the mic to do the work, it wont.

 

Also, try to avoid sending these to subs. A simple left and right mix whilst useable is far from ideal for this application. Matrices on certain desks and enough ins and outs on crossovers should allow you to adjust what goes to tops and subs. For example matrix 1 and 2 maybe set up for sub left and right, and matrix 3 and 4 for top left and right. If you group these mics together you can send this group only to the tops. It does mean that if you run a high crossover point then they might start to sound a bit thin. You may have to lower this. However, it beats endless LF feedback and rumbling.

[paulears]

They should really stop referring to these things as clip ons. In the video world, then clipping them on is fine - but stuck to a lapel, with a quiet voice on a nosiy stage is a major problem. Gain before feedback is dreadful. So if you have Senns, then get the mic closer to the talents mouth, and they'll behave much better. There are quite a few topics on this subject in the sound section.

[Mr Steve]

Using ME2s on the lapel for a show is a pain. Gain before feedback is reduced and the talent tend to move their heads which would be the same as someone moving the mic during their piece. I would recommend either removing the clips and gripping the mics into the hairline of the cast, or as mentioned above, getting some of the £30 CPC skin tone headset mics. We've used these in our last show and they worked surprisingly well. The key is keeping the mic close to the mouth.

 

You say the mics you have are very sensitive, have you tried taking the gain down on the beltpack itself?

[marxman58]

In my sadly considerabe experience of school productions . the MDs think that " We'll mic up the cast before the show, we dont need them for rehearsals so any weak voices will be totally fine", and " We cant have any mics visible because the audience will realise that its not real !!!!". WRONG, the cast shall ware headset mics or Im out off here. With an inexperienced cast it is IMPOSSIBLE to have controll of the vocals any other way. Im sure that the audience would prefer to hear the show clearly than moan that the cast had some funny thing attached to to their faces, plus headsets are so much easier to deal with in costume change overs. Sorry, just trying to exorcise some deamons. Im all better now, Arrrrr. actually no, I still feel the pain.

[Ynot]

With an inexperienced cast it is IMPOSSIBLE to have controll of the vocals any other way.

 

Actually, I (and likely many others) will have to beg to differ there.

 

The key thing to do from the start of any rehearsals is to educate the talent in the correct ways of vocal projection, both spoken and sung. That way, when (and IF) mics are used for the final production they are there just as a support for the voice and not a crutch.

 

Talent must always learn to project, otherwise it's pointless giving them a mic in the first place!

 

Anyway, that's a bit OT, and has been discussed many many times here already!

[Matt Riley]

Okay, whoever told you that mics with a cardiod pickup pattern were good for vocals was talking complete sense.

 

-If you're choosing a handheld mic for use with a band.

 

Here in theatre land, dahling, things are a bit different because the mic is fixed to the talent and is often much closer to the mouth than a lead singer's SM58, and so all of the pro shows I've ever seen the spec for have used omni capsules for this very reason. They will work well, if you can get them 'rung out' using an EQ by a competent person, and if placed properly. Good placement options include in the hairline, using surgical tape covered with makeup taping the wire to the forehead or under the ear - either using a proper headset mic based on the Countryman E6 or DPA 4088, or the CPC lookalikes, or by adapting the ME2 with some florists wire to get the right placement pointing at the corner of the mouth.

 

All the best,

 

Matt

[Brock]

Sorry, you are correct that the EW112 G2 relates to the wireless system. I can confirm the capsule is an ME-2.

[Ben.]

As a few people have already said, CPC do some great headband mics that will work with your Sennheiser belt packs.

The last time I used these they performed well when working with spoken and sung voices.

 

One thing I will recommend is setting the attenuation on your transmitters and receivers during rehearsals to avoid clipping, but maximum signal levels.

There is a large level difference between speech and someone singing.

 

Something you can pretty much guarantee when using headband/set mics is the distance of the capsule from the mouth, therefore you should at least get a consistent sound rather than a lapel mic, where the user may tend to turn from the capsule or lean into it. Proximity effect and all that.....

 

Having said all that, I am sure you can get the ME-2's to work well if your budget doesn't stretch, just comments from my personal opinion.

[Bobbsy]

ME2 microphones are used successfully day in, day out in theatre situations.

 

As has been said, the normal mounting for these will be either up in the hairline (with the mic just peeping out down the forehead) or over the ear with the capsule somwhere around where sideburns would go on a man. In the rare show with very high sound levels, I've made homemade "booms" out of bent coat hangers and Hellerman tubing. Of the first two, the hairline is the preferred location for a nice natural sound.

 

One place the mics never go is clipped onto clothing...unless your a TV studio with no sound reinforcement needed!.

 

To expand a bit on what matt riley said, for theatre applications Omni pattern mics are the norm and desireable. Because of the extreme movement you're going to get in a theatre situation (actors looking upstage, downstage and offstage in quick succession, the "beamy" nature of a cardioid pattern is far more likely to cause you problems with uneven pickup and (sometimes) feedback. The only time you might use a cardioid or tighter pattern would be on a headset-style mic in a show with high levels. Think Madonna!

 

When you go to a west end musical, the mics you see are almost always MKE2s or a Countryman or DPA equivalent...all omnis. If you can't get enough gain before feedback with the ME2 then it's time to start tweaking elsewhere in the system rather than changing mics.

 

Bob

[blackrose]

the only problem I can see with using ME-2's is if (like many school productions) the budget is tight and the mics are moving form person to person. if this is the case, then the old coathanger trick is the best way to deal with it, and I would personally heat shink the mic cable to it as this can be cut at a later date. (also heat shink the other end other wise it could get a bit painfull.)

 

just my 2p worth