What is required for setting up a hire business?

[mcinnes01]

Hi,

 

I'm currently a student at Salford university, however over the past two years I've developed a bit of an obsession for lighting, I've now got a fairly decent sized rig that is fully DMX controllable which I've programmed myself and can control from my laptop. I've also just branched out and got some big pa speakers in the hope that combined with all my DJ equipment I can set up a small sound and lighting hire business.

 

Baring this in mind I'm wondering how the best way would be to make my idea a reality, so my question is, is there any legislation or standards that my equipment must be rated to (e.g. PAT testing), do I have to be insured and what type of insurance do I need, do I need certification (e.g. PLAZA or for using a laser) and if so what type of training? etc (all questions in relevance of protecting myself financially, my equipment and the public)

 

Hope you can help,

 

Andy

[lightjocky]

Hi there,

 

I have gone on a little business venture so here it goes.

 

I to am obsessed with lighting I have always had an eye for business so with my dads help:

 

1. we registered a company name

2. we registered a company bank account

3. we purchased PUBLIC LIABILITY, PROPERTY AND CONTENTS INSURANCE

4.we brought and registered a website

5.I began to purchase lighting in small quantity's I already had quite abit

6. luckily we have a van driver at my dads business so the travel was not a problem (large heavy items in this business)

7. sorted out stationary, tshirts, lanyards etc more professional

8. pat testing is done with every hire by an electrician based in the same building as us and a cable tie is put on the unit every time it is tested and the old one removed PAT testing is now a legal requirement

9. your laser question depends on the class of the laser this topic has been covered here before but we have a moving head laser that requires a trained "laser" professional and things such as audience scans sometimes carnt be done but check with you supplier for further details

 

in terms of the sound we have D&B systems and stock a few desks etc we arnt really so big in the sound department but it all gets used well

 

we now stock colour web, 22 mac 250 8 mac 550 8 mac 600 about 100 par cans 64, 48 LED cans, power distro and desks zero88 and hogs and plenty of AV

all of this equipment is now paid for in full and under my ownership

 

My aim in life is that in a few years I can take over this business and have it as a living all of the purchases made were all my myself after working long and hard.

 

what sort of jobs / gigs do you do ?

 

I hope this gives you an answer to some of your questions

good luck

jamie

[pritch]

Yes, you will have to be insured. You will need public liability insurance as a bare minimum; as for insurance for your gear, well that's down to you really. Also bear in mind that if you're using a private car for carrying your gear, then you'll need to tell your insurance company that you're using it for business purposes.

 

There's no legal requirement that equipment be PAT tested, but there is a legal requirement that equipment you provide is safe to use, and the generally accepted way of proving this is through PAT testing. In addition to this, there are venues out that that won't let you bring gear on site unless you can show that it's been tested.

[mcinnes01]

Hi,

 

I currently haven't done any jobs/gigs just a few house parties, the majority of my effort has been put in to programming my fixtures which I had no experience of and had to teach myself. I'm looking to supply originally for mobile dj's and bands who don't own any equipment, parties functions etc, then branch out into media solutions including video projection and events lighting. I also have quite a few friends who are DJ's in local clubs so I plan to organize some events, although one of my ideas for the near future was to have some laser parties at a club in manchester, however I think I made need to have some certification to operate it as its a class 3b.

 

Thanks for the help,

 

andy

[lightjocky]

I was always under the impression that PAT testing was a legal requirment

you are also right legal or not most places dont let you use gear without a recent PAT test

jamie

[Andrew C]

I was always under the impression that PAT testing was a legal requirement

Nope. As said above; you legally have to 'maintain your equipment so as to be safe'. You can't do that if you don't know whether it is safe or not. Ergo the requirement to test.

[StevieR]

Hi Andy,

 

As a business owner, the first thing to be said is that it is a LOT of hard work. It will also require a fair amount of cash if you are looking to make a return reasonably quickly.

 

Possibly the first thing to do is sit down and work out the feasibility of the project. Draw up a basic business plan. This will help you work out what the business will aim to do, how it will make money and potentially how much, what the running costs will be and what potential customers are out there. Make sure you research your local market. Is there room for a company such as you're proposing in the local area or are there too many other similar outfits chasing the same customers? Get the pen and paper out and work through the figures. You need to be realistic with the cashflow before jumping in.

 

Another thing you may want to ask yourself is why you want to go into business? Do you want to simply want to work with the 'toys' and enjoy it - or do you want to make money? If the latter then you need to take a step back and manage a business which often involves handing a lot of the 'fun' stuff over to others.

 

I would say however, that although it has been very tiring and has taken a lot out of me and my life, there is a great sense of accomplishment when I look back and see where my efforts have taken me.

 

Hope these thoughts help a little.

 

Steve

[mcinnes01]

Hi,

 

I currently study business and management so drawing up a proper business plan and forecast will also allow me use some of the skills I've learnt and also get I realistic idea as to what returns I could expect. Would you suggest trying to get some experience by working for a lighting company over the summer, and would this provide me with some of the training which would be useful e.g. Health and Safety or more lighting specific?

 

Also how much does PAT testing usually cost and are there companies that specifically PAT test sound and lighting equipment?

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the help,

 

andy

[cedd]

There are plenty of domestic/small business-centred PAT companis around, but you'll find most won't touch some of the bigger lighting and sound pieces of kit (we has one refuse anything on plugs larger than 13A rating as he "wasn't trained to test them".). It might be an idea if you're not too fussed about going it alone, to get a competent sparkie on your team. Not only because it really does help with maintenance, but because your hirers will look to YOU as the hire company for advice -

 

"Hi there, I would like 4 x Mac 250's, 20 Par 56's and some dimmers, will that be ok on my garage supply?"

 

A good technical grounding somewhere in your company is essential. I don't doubt your ability as a DJ, programmer and general producer of decent results, but knowing how it works, why it works and when it's not safe really is going to be needed.

 

Target your local schools and think about what they'll want to hire for their school productions. What can't they afford lots of that will really polish off their show? - Radio mics, stage blocks, tiered seating, large (32ch) mixer, decent speakers, multicore. Those were always the first items I went out looking to hire. Lots of cable is also ideal and can be quite a good money spinner (10m XLR cable, bought for £8.00, hired at £2.00 for the week = profit in five weeks) not much, but if each school or group hire 10 cables which is a small hire on my books, that's £20 for a box full of copper every week.

[Andrew C]

Obvious, but I don't think anyone has mentioned it yet; premises. You need somewhere to store, maintain, PAT and maybe demo all this kit you might own. Add an office, a tea room (if you have staff), and toilets.

 

A well known :) south-coast hire outfit started in a house not too far from where I sit. It is believed that this was the root of the demise of a marriage.

 

You should really look at doing the PAT in-house. In an ideal world (your risk assessment may say differently) that all the kit should be tested prior to each hire. Otherwise, how can you be sure the last bunch of overenthusiastic muppets didn't break something, and rather than own up, 'repaired' to a rather less than workmanlike standard? Doing the course isn't expensive, and a cheap tester could pay for itself quickly in slack times doing local offices etc (as another member local to me does)

[Jivemaster]

Get your uni's careers people to sort out a meetoing with at least one small business advisor. The Uni has an interest in seeing you leaving to employment or self employment, its one of their judgement criteria.

 

Its easy to get the kit it's difficult to get the business, getting the work in at commercial rates is the one big challenge. Many companies are struggling to keep above water, and are sometimes buying work at less than cost to stay up a while in the hopes of.......

[paulears]

Storage and insurance is a major headache. Commercial storage does not exist at anything other than premium price. The revenue and VAT people are fine really, but you really need when starting out to ask an accountants advice on how you should do the business side of the project. Look at the initial cost and the residual value after a few years - you'll be amazed how worthless some really is. The other factor that needs thinking about is will it really make money. Many people attempt to put together a business plan and predict how much they will make. One good tip to put it into perspective is to also look at a business nothing to do with this area of work, and compare the income from that - so maybe consider what else you could put your money and expertise into, and then compare the two. If you have some money to invest in the business - work out the return. What I mean is could you invest the same sort of capital into say buying an old dilapidated terraced property, spend a few grand doing it up, and then selling it onto the market. What would your likely profit be? Then consider buying some sound and light kit, and hiring that out - I bet it won't produce the same return, and the incidental running costs may well be higher. You might get away with an old van for the house renovation, but need a decent 'image' one for a hire firm?

 

 

Maybe you find some storage space - would you make more hiring the space out, rather than filling it with expensive stock sitting on a shelf. I had the misfortune of needing some storage space in a hurry - Big Yellow was the only thing I could find and this is what made me realise secure storage is damn expensive!

[dave singleton]

With the greatest of respects I smell Bull S**t!

 

You've purchased all of this at 15? In the past 2 months you've come out with some cracking comments about needing stuff for school etc, however if you had this lot in stock why not use that? I would also like to draw your attension to the £21k you have reported to have spent on hires through school. Surely with that much kit in stock you'd be pocketing a hell of alot of money, so why does that bother you enough to want to upgrade the schools kit to reduce hire?

[dbuckley]

The other thing I should mention is that you need to have what people want to hire, which may not be the same kit you want to use yourself.

[Stuart Basson]

You might get away with an old van for the house renovation, but need a decent 'image' one for a hire firm?

 

A chum has drifted into LX & sound hire & operation, from a residential base. My theatre is currently awash with his tackle since his ropey van blew up. My patience is not inexhaustible. You need to be able to deliver on time, and - with my resident SM hat on - you need to take it away on time, too. Access to reliable transport and the willingness to use it on Saturday nights come quite high on my list of things needed by a hire firm! :unsure:

 

 

Do you even need to do a course to PAT test, I was under tbe impression you simply need to be "competent"

 

A great way of attaining competence quickly is by undertaking appropriate and well-delivered training. I found that offered by the ABTT to be most useful.