Radio pack placement

[munster]

I have been using the sennheiser evolution300's (G1) for a recent theatre production. They were used by children and due to the tight clothing that was worn throughout the production I was losing AF throughout the week. All of the transmitters were placed in body bags. They usually dropped out when ever someone sat down or moved too much. The packs had just been serviced and had new mics and arials. I just wondered if anyone could offer a solution to better placement on the body. One guy strapped the transmitter to his back with micropore. This was fine unitl we lost all signal and had to delve into a never ending amount of tape to check the connections.

 

Thanks for reading! :)

[paulears]

Where were the receivers? placing the aerial next to a big lump of body always attenuates th effective radiated power, pretty well no matter what you do - a bit like having an sponge soaking up 180 degrees worth of your output - gets worse when the sweat. Finding somewhere where the aerial system is away from the body does help - but rarely achieved. In most cases putting the tx in a tie on pouch allows a little more rf to get out. My guess is that you have the receivers front of house - a long way from the talent. A simple solution is to simply move them closer in so the attenuated rf from the packs is still enough. You said AF - rather than RF, but I'm assuming you mean rf signal was the issue - losing AF is usually down to real faults.

[w/robe]

Not often I even read the sound forum let alone reply!

 

The 2 favourite positions that I have found for people with lots of movement or tight costumes are either in the small of the back or on the inner thigh. Either way you need to have the pouches made to fit.

 

I've had people do back flips with packs on their backs and not loose them.

[Ynot]

I have been using the sennheiser evolution300's (G1) for a recent theatre production. They were used by children and due to the tight clothing that was worn throughout the production I was losing AF throughout the week. All of the transmitters were placed in body bags. They usually dropped out when ever someone sat down or moved too much. The packs had just been serviced and had new mics and arials. I just wondered if anyone could offer a solution to better placement on the body.

Hi, and welcome to the Blue Room.

 

I've not used the Senn 300's, but have a goodly number of EW100's in regular use here, and I don't think the transmitter packs are greatly different in style, so here goes.

 

The most common point of fault, IME, is the point at which the mic cable goes into the plug. This is ESPECIALLY prone to problems if the talent (or the sound techs!) wrap the cable around the transmitter when not in use (something I've been fighting to get our people NOT to do for years, without much success!!). If the cables are treated in this way, or have gotten pulled at any stage, then this is my best bet for your problem, assuming you do mean AF, not RF as paul suspects. The only cure for this fault is to buy some new Senn plugs, strip back the cable and re-terminate.

 

One thing to watch, though, is any replacement plugs. We had some a couple of years back that were JUST too long for the sockets on the transmitters - thus causing a poor connection at times. I've just repaired over a dozen of our mic stock last month, using pukka Sennheiser plugs andthey all seem fine.

 

As for the position of body packs, that depends entirely on the costume & range of movement of the character. We have a strict "Use the cloth pouch" policy, so essentially the average talent ties the strings about their waist either under or over some or all of the costume. Some may have suitable poskets in which to hide them, but that sometimes causes more problems getting the mic cable to their head.

they key,however, is to place the pack somewhere where it won't cause the cable to kink at any stage, or cause it to pull the cable tight. That, as I say, can vary from talent to talent.

 

Hope this helps.

[StevieR]

Bodypack transmitters are designed to be used alongside the body and expect to have some of their signal absorbed - this is why they have a higher output than the equivalent handheld transmitters.

 

If keeping them attached is a problem then pouches are a great help. Canford do a range to fit most sizes of pack.

 

If signal strength is poor at the receivers then either ...

 

a) Move the receivers closer to the performers. I usually site them at the side of the stage.

 

b) Use antenna booster amplifiers. Essential when using multiple packs and antenna splitters. Sennheiser do the AB2 boosters which give the signal a 10db gain.

 

 

HTH

 

Steve

[Bobbsy]

A couple of comments:

 

First, by all means buy one of the Canford pouches...I'd recommend the velcro sort rather than one with buckles (you'll see what I mean in the catalogue) because they sit flatter under tight costumes. However, something similar is VERY easy for a seamstress to make and very cheap in materials. If I were you, I'd buy one and then chat up the costume department to use it as a rough template to knock you up a pile of home made ones.....

 

Second, I'd urge caution with antenna boosters. The good ones are okay (and the Sennheiser unit mentioned is fine) but cheaper ones can add phase jitter etc that messes up your RF. I recently managed to earn a nice fee for sorting out somebody's radio system...and my fix was to remove some generic signal boosters. Also, be aware that, unless the booster is near the antenna rather than the receiver, it just raises the whole noise floor.

 

Bob

[p.k.roberts]

All of the transmitters were placed in body bags. They usually dropped out when ever someone sat down or moved too much.

 

The elastic/velcro belt packs that Canford supply come from here and I've found them to be very good.

 

http://www.firstsense.co.uk/bodyPouch.htm

[SeanT]

Which brand of 9V batteries are you using? We've had nasty issues with 100 G1s using cheap batteries.

[paulears]

I wonder why we all spend out time answering questions from new posters - in this case, munster joins, asks a question and then never ever comes back. It does rather make the thread pointless - but quite a few interesting things have come up. Sean - I've never had any issues - what batteries did you have trouble with?

[SeanT]

Some black/silver Gold Peak ones, but to be fair it may have been a duff batch - we only ever normally use the gold coloured GPs. I seem to faintly remember having some trouble when I used some that were hastily grabbed from a local newagent too, god knows what they were!

[boswell]

Which brand of 9V batteries are you using? We've had nasty issues with 100 G1s using cheap batteries.

 

GPB High power Alkaline PP3 from CPC (BT0008204) 68p each for 30+

 

No problems with them, use a fresh set for each show.

 

B

[SeanT]

as above

[munster]

as above :(

So you think that the battereis may have something to do with these issues. We normally use the GPB gold white and black PP3's. In reply to paulears I had a teminal virus on my machine. This has obviously hindered my internet access somewhat. Thanks to everyone who replied.

[Ynot]

So you think that the battereis may have something to do with these issues. We normally use the GPB gold white and black PP3's. In reply to paulears I had a teminal virus on my machine. This has obviously hindered my internet access somewhat. Thanks to everyone who replied.

A good rule of thumb with RM batteries is to find a QUALITY battery that you like and get on with (spend a bit of time assessing different makes if you need to) then stick withthat brand. But they MUST be quality alakaline batts.

I have always used Duracell Procell (buy in boxes of 400!) and normally get 2 shows out of each one, with a bit left over for rehearsals.

 

TD

[Seano]

We have a strict "Use the cloth pouch" policy, so essentially the average talent ties the strings about their waist either under or over some or all of the costume.

In most cases, I've found ties to be a liability. Nice wide elastic (at least 38mm) and a generous amount of velcro is the way forward, imo. Comfortable and secure.

 

However, something similar is VERY easy for a seamstress to make and very cheap in materials.

So easy in fact, that a noise person with a little time on his/her hands can do it. I used to make my own mostly. If you're going to get Wardrobe to do it though, I've always found a nice bottle of wine goes down well. :(

 

But they MUST be quality alakaline batts.

I'd have agreed with you when I was doing noise (its been a while). NiMH batteries have come on enormously since then, they last longer than alkalines, they're much better for the environment and in anything beyond the short-term they're much cheaper too - as long as you can get the charging organised!

 

Sean

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