Monitor Mix

[conan]

I have been asked to mix monitors for a band at the weekend but I have never mixed monitors before or used any monitor desk. All I know is that the venue has a dedicated soundcraft 24 channel monitor desk,BSS graphic EQ and Yamaha fx unit and beringher gates and comps. They also have B&C and Beyma loaded boxes.

 

1) Do you just plug the mic/line source into a channel and mix from Aux sends like from FOH?

2)Do you just bring The FX unit (if used) back on a channel and run it off an aux?

3) Do you put the graphic in line with the desk and amp or is there an isnert point?

4) Is there any specific way to do the souncheck (ie Do I gate the kick etc like on FOH)

 

 

Thanks

[k_j_love]

1) Do you just plug the mic/line source into a channel and mix from Aux sends like from FOH?

2)Do you just bring The FX unit (if used) back on a channel and run it off an aux?

3) Do you put the graphic in line with the desk and amp or is there an isnert point?

4) Is there any specific way to do the souncheck (ie Do I gate the kick etc like on FOH)

 

 

Thanks

 

 

In answer to your question;

 

1) Usually there will be a stage splitter on the stage at some point, this will take the mic/line sources and will split it down a FOH multicore and into the mons desk. Other ways are to utilise the direct outs if the mon desk should have it, basically using the MON desk as a split. But this is not usually done in the industry.

 

2) When I do mons I rarely use an FX unit, although some bands like to here their reverb coming through ever so slightly on the mons. But I have never seen the need for FX over mons. No band have requested it and no problems have occured to require the use of FX.

 

3) Graphics in general are put in line with the desk and mon amp BUT, for each way of mon mix there should really be a Graphic. IF you have only one way of monitors then that should be fine, if not I would really recommend the use of more graphics. You can get two way of mix of one graphic assuming you use mono mons.

 

4) Soundchecking wise I have always waitied for the FOH engineer to go through the channels and check them individually. Again Gating and Compressing (IF REQUIRED!) while the check goes on. When the FOH engineer stops the channel check I then go through each of the mon mixes and see what the band would like in them. Then when finished the FOH engineer will go through some songs, allowing the artist to change mon settings or tweak if required.

 

Hope this helps, but without knowing actual details about venue multi runs or splits and artist requirements I have had to make a generalisation.

 

Kris

[Sim]

Was thinking about this question the other day aswell, thanks k j love. your answer was just what I needed.

[k_j_love]

Yeah really just depends on each individual circumstance.

 

If everything went to plan and was organised so that everyone knew what was happening when and where, the industry wouldnt be the same atmosphere.

[jayselway]

I was always taught to insert the graphics on a monitor desk, so that if you bring up a mon send in your listen wedge, then it will sound very similar to that of the one on stage.... (so long as all the wedges are the same....)

[k_j_love]

I was always taught to insert the graphics on a monitor desk, so that if you bring up a mon send in your listen wedge, then it will sound very similar to that of the one on stage.... (so long as all the wedges are the same....)

 

Ah good point indeed and something I have not thought of, my mistake. :)

[conan]

thats cool cheers, but do you mix each monitor from auxes or is it on the faers and do u plug the your listen monitor to a master send so you can hear the diffrent mixes

[Simon Lewis]

do you mix each monitor from auxes or is it on the faers and do u plug the your listen monitor to a master send so you can hear the diffrent mixes

 

You mix each monitor send on the relevant auxiliary control.

 

The channel fader does not have to be used at all, but can be used in two ways:

 

1) Set the auxes prefade and use the fader as an additional stereo send (for in ear mixes or sidefills)

2) Set the auxes postfade and use the fader as an overall level control for that one instrument.

 

The listen wedge gets plugged into the PFL output. In fact, if you are using a Spirit Monitor desk, there's an output marked "wedge". By pressing the pfl button, you can listen to an individual channel or a whole mix through the wedge.

 

 

Simon

[jim b]

2) Set the auxes postfade and use the fader as an overall level control for that one instrument.

 

The listen wedge gets plugged into the PFL output. In fact, if you are using a Spirit Monitor desk, there's an output marked "wedge". By pressing the pfl button, you can listen to an individual channel or a whole mix through the wedge.

 

Having all the aux sends postfade allows you a quick get out of jail free card if you see, for example, a lead singer drop his mic. Pulling the fader eliminates both the bump from any impact and also any feedback from the mic heading straight towards a wedge.

 

On the listen wedge front take care because some desks have different levels for AFL and PFL which you can't change so you need to pull back the overall level of the listen wedge when you PFL a channel. Not sure about the Spirit monitor but some desks (SM20 and Series 5 monitor from Soundcraft) have a PFL trim and an AFL trim per aux. The individual trims are very useful as you can set all your listening to be at the same level without turning up or down the wedge level. This lets you concentrate on the important things during the show.

 

A top tip I was given by another monitor engineer the first time I ran monitors was: Only look away from the band to find a pot. i.e. when someone asks for a change look at your desk, find the setting you need to change (get their mix in your wedge too), then look at them while you move it until they are satisfied. During the show your eyes should be all over the stage trying to pick up on hints and signals from the band about what needs to change in their mix. Also during soundcheck get yourself out and standing in the same place as each person you're mixing for to enable you to hear what's actually going on on stage-you may hear problems before they actually take off.

 

Also when you've stopped feeling nervous don't forget to enjoy it-mixing monitors can be very rewarding.

 

Jim

[k_j_love]

Also when you've stopped feeling nervous don't forget to enjoy it-mixing monitors can be very rewarding.

 

 

Amen to that.

 

It is a worth while thing to do and slightly less stressful than being out in the front. Enjoy it even if it sounds pants cause your in the wings.

[Mr.Si]

I'm oif the thought that mixing monitors is muchly more important than FOH.

 

- If the band ain't happy in hearing themselves properly, they won't play as well.

If they don't play as well, the punters might not enjoy themselves as much.

If the punters don't enjoy themselves, they may not come again and there goes a reduction in ticket sales.

 

I've never mixed monitors, (never had the chance to), but I'd love to.

[paulears]

I'd have to disagree with some of this. You normally need to sort the monitor mix first, or the band can't play properly for the soundcheck - they need to hear themselves - hearing just the house will be very odd for them - so I'd do mons first, every time (or they moan)

 

If it's a proper monitor desk then it works slightly differently to a foh desk - gain and channel fader the same, then the auxes send to dedicated monitor channels - these do need graphics for optimum volume before feedback, but for not quite so critical use, the channel eq isn't too bad - maybe keep your graphics to insert in line on problem channels.

 

FX - I've found that singers often need more reverb in their mons than anybody else - certainly more than foh will want - if you are using auto-tune, then mon mix is critical - them hearing the tuned version make some people sing out of control. So watch that one.

[k_j_love]

I'd have to disagree with some of this. You normally need to sort the monitor mix first, or the band can't play properly for the soundcheck - they need to hear themselves - hearing just the house will be very odd for them - so I'd do mons first, every time (or they moan)

 

Yeah too right, But rather than go through each channel to set levels for mons then FOH they can be done in one swoop. Once the channels are done, Mons can or indeed should be sorted before FOH engineer creates the mix.

 

Monitors are just as important, but not as stressful. Your behind the scenes and there is less pressure on you when you.

 

Plus, a Dedicated monitor desk is a good send and as jimb says, post-fade is the way I go down, allowing greater control should a artist drop a mic or fluff a pick-up.

 

Kris

[paulears]

Monitors are just as important, but not as stressful. Your behind the scenes and there is less pressure on you when you.

 

Not as stressfull? - give me FOH anytime - monitor mixing is far, far worse - most artsistes accept to a degree that monitor mixing via auxes from FOH doesn't allow a terrifically fine degree of control - but with monitor mixing on stage the artists will demand complex cues and subtle effects and balance changes on a song by song basis - they know this is possible, and musically makes a hell of a lot of sense, but as you can't hear exactly what they can hear unless you have a proper engineering wedge your life gets pretty miserable. Get two or three musicians who wish this level of complexity and life is quite 'interesting'. Out front you have just one mix - one stage you have to do multiple mixes all at the same time.

[dbuckley]

I'm oif the thought that mixing monitors is muchly more important than FOH. ... I've never mixed monitors, (never had the chance to), but I'd love to.

Ditto, or at least not on a "proper" monitors system.

 

As a competent FOH mix guy, I always thought I got the easy job: In thruth, I'm answering to me, and am in control of my environment, and get to hear what the punters hear. The monitor guy, on the other hand, has to do not one mix but many, all at the same time, to a very demanding audience who knows exactly (and sometimes unreasonably) what he/she wants to hear, and (ears excepted) cant actually hear what it sounds like as every inch of the stage has a different mix of on-stage racket. Add to that the problem that all the speakers are pointing at the mics so encouraging squealing. And you're close enough to be yelled at, scowled at, or even have a Les Paul land on your head (and desk).

 

Yep, monitor engineers have my admiration every day of the week.