I am looking to replace my ageing consumer level MD player with something new for playback, I am still drawn to minidisc for its versatility, speed of recording thru netMD etc, but I am looking for a more pro level machine this time, I am looking to spend ideally between 2-300GBP but up to 500.
I have contemplated using a laptop, but cannot justify its expense for something that will do its job properly,ie a dedicated machine.
any suggestions gratefully received

Much as I still think MD has a lot going for it, your choice is quite limited. The Tascam 300 series is about the only pro machine still properly available, and my guess is that won't be about for long. For my money the Tascam is still pretty good, although a little confusing when it comes to setting auto pause, etc.

When MD finally goes, I'm not sure what will replace it - there are plenty of software systems, but how do people walk in with their tracks and ensure they playout properly. I suppose CD, but I don't really like it, or trust it. Very often even getting the time to convert a CD into something else isn't possible - AND many turns object to you keeping a copy of their tracks. If they have copyright material, then it also involves, if you play the copyright game properly, MCPS as you are doing a transfer.

Not really much help, this post - now I've typed it!

cheers, I am looking for suggestions of machine, and I agree CD isnt reliable enough for live work, worked on a show where a last minute change on cd for the first night didnt work, CDRW didnt work on my player!

I couldn't agree more. I'm afraid beggars can't be choosers. Have a look at musicvillage... www.musicvillageschools.co.uk for no other reason than to see whats on the market. They tend to have quite a comprehensive list.

However any good supplier will point you in the direction of a good model... but I would have to say anything from the Tascam 300 series is your best bet!

We have a Tascam MD-301 Mk2 in our FOH rig which mostly gets used for recording speech, and it's a relatively good example of what MD can do.

With so many PC's/Macs able to write CD's and with the media being so cheap as to be practically "disposable", I've settled on CD playback for most of the shows I've done, unless I've needed the editing flexibility of MD, or the excuse of not having a CD player in the rig (therefore not being able to do requests...)

I was a fan of minidisk but when my old decks began to age I looked for replacements and was very worried about the lack of choice on the market, especially if you want Autopause which I consider essential.

For that reason, I made the move to computers and now wouldn't want to go back to MD at all.

There are lots of exotic systems out there, but for basic "push a button and go" functionality, you could do worse than downloading Soundplant which is freeware.

"But I can't afford a computer!" I hear you scream. Well, the thing with Soundplant is that it works happily on any old piece of computer tat. For the panto I just did, I had Soundplant on an ancient (but refurbished) Pentium 166 with a 20 gig hard drive, running Windows 98. I picked this up for under a hundred quid, added Soundplant and my old copy of Cool Edit 2000 for editing cues and voila, I was in business.

The computer is a clean install with only Win98, Soundplant and Cooledit on it...and it's worked flawlessly since it put it together 3 years ago.

So...something to think about.

(Of course, like the drugs pusher, once you're hooked I'll tell you about running SFX on a modern PC with multichannel soundcard for outputs.....)

Bob

OK, but im still not completly convinced about using a PC for live sound they seem t be inherently unreliable, with crashing part of the course, especially with MS based machines.
Help, im getting more confused now!!!!!

Well, keeping it to a clean install, not messed up with games, internet, chat programmes etc etc. I can put my hand on my heart and say I've had zero problems with crashes, freezes etc.

This is better than the performance I had from 3 MD decks (two Sony and a Tascam) over the same period of time.

Bob

Have you found a really quick way to get the visiting turns cd or md into soundplant? The other thing is when they also need track three to run into track 4 including all the silence because that's how they do it. Fair enough, you can edit the tracks in your editor to be the same as the original media, but this takes time - often more time than I have. A lampie up a ladder is busy. A man sitting front of a screen is not, and nobody is ever going to believe it!

We still get people handing over cassettes, that can't be used anymore. We used to dub them to md, but even the time that took was sometimes just not available. As in turns arrive at 5pm, fiddle a bit, hand over the media and want a soundcheck straight away - no chance of half an hour while I edit and load the track. These are people I would like a solution for.

Well, in a pinch I've been known to run CD tracks directly off the PC's CD drive. In a way, there's and advantage to this since a typical drive in a PC is far more tolerant of "home-burned" disks than some older CD players. However, more normally I use a "ripping" programme (EAC) which I forgot to mention was part of the "theatre install" on the computer I mentioned. Where there IS a bit of time, this process is quicker than a real-time dub to Mini Disk.

To be fair though, I'm not pedantic about using only a computer. There are places for CDs and where appropriate I still bring in a playback deck. For example, if the show requires me to play "walk in" music, I often leave that on CD so the computer is available to me for last minute dubs/tweaks/checks etc.

However, for playback of tightly cued effects or music during the show...I'm convinced that computer playback is the way to go.

This thread is about a replacement for a simple MD system and that's what I costed/recommended. However, when a show gets more elaborate and requires multiple effects routings etc., then the computer (albeit something a bit newer than the old clunker I mentioned!) really comes into its own.

Bob

Well go on then, I'm sure we're all hooked!

Brian

PS what sound card were you using on your 98 laptop?

The answer to PC crashing is often in the myriad of things actually running. The solution for me was a cheap lap top Toshiba satelite 4070 with a clean install of W2K - Plays music from the prog and also through the cd-rom drive. Pcs have the advantage of playing cdrws that cd players dont.

All in good time, grasshopper!



In this case it was an Echo Mia. It worked well, but to be honest it was chosen because I happened to have it lying around after I converted my main DAW for multitrack use.

I HAVE seen many playbacks done with just the basic Sound Blaster type card. They're a bit noisy on record but seem okay for playback, though you have to work round the problem of an unbalanced output.

Bob

One method I've used to avoid a noisy card output is to choose a card with an electrical digital output, then route that into an external DAC...

As it happens my hifi DAC has balanced line outs on XLR, and I picked it up (second hand) for about £60 if memory serves correctly... Perhaps I found a bargain, but it's a working solution nonetheless!

I have to agree with Jivemaster about running a completely clean PC, as this does greatly increase reliability and Windows XP is much more stable than 95 or 98.
Anyone who is contemplating one of these pc's should look at XP lite by http://www.litepc.com/ this program allows you to cut a lot of the crap out of windows that you even get with a clean install, for example it can be used to completely remove Internet Explorer and also all the driver Inf files that windows puts on the hdd. This makes the installation much smaller and faster, so small in fact that it is possible to do a fully working install to a flash card (256mb is the smallest I've read about).

I also totally agree with JiveMaster, personally Ive never had a laptop crash on me during a show, and Ive run quite a few now. One other problem I have found with laptops is that it you have them running off a transformer during the show you sometimes get some interference which can be easily worked around, but sometimes a pain. Good idea to test your laptop by running it through a desk. Personally as Ive said before computerised can be good, I like it personally. Have you tired Sound Cue System which I really like or CSMD which when I looked last had updated and included a CD Player which I can see might be quite useful. Not played with it yet though so cant really comment, sorry!.

Matt

You're having problems 'cos you haven't converted to PCStage yet Although running direct from CDs is fairly hateful, at least PCStage does it moderately well.

A fellow PCStager, Butch Bos, wrote this a while ago about using a PC with twin CD drives for a dance competition:


The other thing you can do is rip the tracks onto hard disk using say goldwave, throw together a cue list, and then use the wave audio end of track event to link subsequent tracks together. You can create the cues and the link whilst the rip is taking place, and then a file select for each of them once ripped, if you've got a fast CD reader it'll be done very quickly, and the gaps will work as they did on CD. It will have been quicker than me typing in what to do here.

To avoid laptop intereference I always run my laptop through DI boxes with the earth lifted, then via XLR from there to desk. it hasn't failed me yet at eliminating Laptop power pack buzz.

Thanks, Ill try that, hopefully it will help.

Matt

I've yet to find a laptop that contains a sound card I'm willing to use for any serious applications. If you go the laptop route I think you're better getting an external sound card connected by USB or Firewire (preferably the latter) to the computer. If you go this route, there's lots that offer a proper balanced output as standard, negating the need for DI boxes.

Bob

I tried one of the Edirol USB devices and still got "digitally" noises, a couple of redundant 1:1 transformers killed it though. Listening to HIFi straight off the 'phones socket as I type. Sounds OK to me!

Personally the best way I have found to run sound effects is with ableton live on a mac
rock solid doesn't crash
add in a midi interface and you can trigger your cues and fade them in as well as triggering multiple cues at the same time

tony

Yeah I use an external USB sound card, much better and does the trick for me. Creative Sound Blaster one that ive got about £80 but cant fault it.

Matt