Hi, everybody!

I have couple of questions, about live band mixing,
I have done simple theatre gigs before but never a live band. I need all the help I can get. So here are my stupid question's:
1. Why don't people connect bass-guitar straight to line and in some cases use mic to take the sound from the speaker where the bass is connected?
2. Whit what do I have to use Di-box?
3. If phantom is turn on from mixing console would it to any harm to radio-mic receiver, would Vocal Microphones work?
4. May I use standard condenser microphones for drum plates?

Thanks

Crash,

Seasons greetings to Estonia!

1. You can simply mic up a bass guitar cabinet, indeed many engineers like to do that in addition to DI, because you then capture some of the sound of the cabinet/amp/combo. You can have problems with hum and odd buzzes though, which is why you can usually rely on a DI to give a cleaner sound.

2. Most DI boxes have 2 jacks; feed the bass into one, and take a lead from the other to the bassist's amp. Take the balanced output from the XLR of the DI box into a mic channel on your desk. That's it. Some DI boxes need a battery, some work from phantom power from the desk.

3. Most radio mic receivers are quite OK with being fed into a mic input with 48V phantom on. Best to use the XLR (Balanced o/p)from the receiver though.

4. Probably. What are drum plates?

All the best,

Pete.

Sorry about that, don't know the exact word. I think it my be "cymbals" note sure

For the Hats, defiently use a condensor, anything with a tight pick up pattern, makes the sound you pick up really tight, dynamics don't seem to fit right on a high hat.

For the rest of the metal work, especially if the drummer is only useing a splash and a ride, and your in a small room, don't bother with condensors on over heads, you could just stick a shure sm57 under each of the cymbals, and mic it up that way, very tight, and controlled.

Di's, use them for anything with a line level out put, ie keyboards, dj's and accoustic guitar pick ups.

To be fair, if you have a look at most band photos, they will give you some ideas on placement, then play with the mics you have, if your ears like what they hear from a specific place, then put a mic there, play with them and find out where it sounds good, and have fun doing so... if you have any more specific questions, feel free to ask.

You said Dj's? Do you mean that I need to put Di's between DJ's mixer and my sound mixer?

If the DJs mixer has RCA line outs, then yes. You could get away with a simple converter lead for short distance runs, but anything more than 5m or down a multicore then you should really be using a DI.

Regarding DJ mixers and DIs, it really depends on the quality of the mixer. If the DJ mixer is vaguely professional and has balanced line outs then a DI is totally unnecessary.

Bob

If phantom is on, would it to something bad to other mic's like sm57?

I think you may have misunderstood DI boxes.

The idea is that they allow a line level source cd's, md's, guitars (although they are lower level) and other gizmos to be connected to a balanced XLR input on the desk. So many people use them for making sure domestic equiped kit with phono outputs interfaces properly to your desk. You could plug a DJ mixer using the phono outputs into the line level jack socket on your 'real' mixer and it would be fine - sometimes, due to poor design in most cases hums appear due to ground loops and other strange causes, and the DI box with the earth lift switch often cures these problems.

A real SM57 will have no problems dealing with 48V phantom power coming down the cable.

You mentioned cymbals - pretty well most people use a condenser mic on these due to the excess high frequencies - 57's work, but don't have much above 15K, so sound a little dull.

One thing you'll find is that there are very few RULES, many, many suggestions - but you will try things out, and if they work for you - great. As you link kit together, DI boxes become very useful ways of solving interface problems using their pads, earth lifts, and different socket types. Like most things, you get what you pay for, but even cheap ones are worth having lying around, just in case.

One more question. We have Passiv Di-s, I hope that when phantom is on then they would still work. Would they work?

Passive DI's will be fine. To be honest, I have never come accross anything that objects to phantom power apart from unbalanced kit where pins one and three of the input get joined together - sticking volts up them makes them do very strange things - but these are just the items where the DI gets used anyway,so isn't normally a problem.

For micing guitar amps: what do use?
I have :
Sennheiser e614
Sennheiser e825s

I think that e614 would be better?

Not come across the 614 before, but having searched the sennheiser website, for it, (didn't take long) the description of what it can handle makes it seem like a good mic.

In my experience, you can get away with using "not very good mics" on electric guitars - I have a Peavey PV1 mic which I use if I run out of others. I also use an E835 by sennheiser on electric guitars. Both work well indeed.

I would quite happily use an 825 on an electric gtr also.

Best thing to do is to try them both out, and see which sounds better. The 825 is a dynamic mic, the 614 is a condenser mic. Condensers tend to be a bit more delicate, so look after it.

Edit: My ultimate mic would be something like a shure SM57 as it is a fantastic mic. I'm sure the Shure Beta 57A is likewise.

Have used condensor mics many times on guitar cabs, and you don't really need to worry about them being 'delicate,' the SPLs they will be subject to are much lower than their limits AFAIK and from what others have said...

I'm sure the 614 would sound good, I have been using a slightly different sennheiser condensor and was impressed with the results, the 825 shouldn't be bad either, as its quite a good 'all round' mic, so try both and see which one you prefer would be my advice.

My 2p
John

Oh that was more to do with the build rather than SPL handling. I agree with you on that about the SPL side of things. But I suppose the build of condensers are getting more robust aswell now.

Si

No quite my experience. Most condensors without a built in pad (10 or 20dB_ do start to sound rough when subjected to too much level. The trouble is the guitar waveform is allready distorted, so the extra distortion is hidden. Try a cheap no pad one on a kick drum or bass guitar and look at the waveform in a computer editor - try it again with a dynamic and the difference is pretty evident. My AKG 414 sounds terrible without the pad, but a cheap chinese one isn't quite so bad. Much is due to the preamp. Some have trouble with loud sounds when powered from a battery - the AKG C1000 is a good example, it works better on phantom if the sound level is too high. There doesn't seem much 'visible' distortion, but there is a noticeable roughness to the sound. If pads weren't important, the makers would leave them off - they cost, after all.

Thin aint exsactli the same subject but it's begginners question

What does crossover, foldback(this isn't the right word, I think) do? Could you explain what does every additional thing in rack and everywhere do?
All whats additional to mixing console, amps,speakers,FX block.

I know, I know this is very stupid questoion but I can't unerstand why to use and what do the to

May I suggest a search?

I've done the search and found very interesting and useful stuff but I still don't understand why do use compressors,limiters and so on. And what they do, where to use them. Some of those things I can understand what they do, I think

Have you tried the ProSoundWeb Study Hall?
Theres a few pages on there which may help, inparticular the Signal Processing Fundamentals article.

Hope this helps.

You might find it useful to read the Soundcraft General Guide to Mixing. It provides a basic description of most things related to analogue mixing, including various signal processing devices.

If sound forum had a FAQ then the Soundcraft General Guide to Mixing should be there! It is very good and every beginner should read it. Also they should read ProSoundWeb Study Hall site.

Thanks to Yorkie & Chris_R

a really good book for beginners is "Live Sound Mixing" by Duncan R Fry. You may be able to purchase it online from the PLASA website. It's really clear on how and why to add outboard equipment to your mix, and there's a good section on solving problems.